Pippin's Song

[Kath]

Um, not really sure where this should go * :( looks round for help* but I was reading the Fellowship a while back and came upon the song that was adapted to form Pippin's song in the RotK film.

I remember that it was said that the song was a hobbit walking song and that it was set to a tune as old as the hills (possibly on the last one). Surely then it should be a happy song, or at least set to a cheery tune, it being hobbitish and all?

So am I correct in saying the original probably was cheery and light and PJ just adapted it to fit the moment, I know he changed the words slightly but did he also change the meaning?

[Ainaserkewen]

Billy Boyd wrote the tune that he sang, part of the most famous Hobbit walking song in the written trilogy. The song he sings in the movies is actually a piece of "The Road Goes Ever On and On", you can find it someone in the first few chapters. Forgive me, my books are at home.

When Billy Boyd comments on writing the tune to his song, he said that he thought it should be archaic, as if the song were passed down from the earlier settlement days of the Shire, and that a great grandfather would pass it down to the younger, happier generations, that would explain the "old as the hills" comment because surely the early settlers made it through hard times, affecting their brand of song writing. This is all fine and good for the movies, but what about the story?

Since Pippin sang written word, we don’t know if it were sad or happy. But the general mood of Pippin when he sings is easily determined. So, even if that song was meant to be chipper and happy, don’t you think Pippin’s mood would have affected how it sounded?

[Firefoot]

The song you're talking about is the third verse of the song that starts Upon the hearth the fire is red, in the chapter Three is Company. All three hobbits sing it; Bilbo wrote the words. The verse is this:

Home is behind, the world ahead,
And there are many paths to tread
Through shadows to the edge of night,
Until the stars are all alight.
Then world behind and home ahead,
We'll wander back to home and bed.
Mist and twilight, cloud and shade,
Away shall fade! Away shall fade!
Fire and lamp, and meat and bread,
And then to bed! And then to bed!

Being that they sang the song as they walked along as the stars came out and "the feeling of disquiet left them," I would say this is a song sung in good cheer. It isn't on the same somber note that it was adapted to in RotK, at any rate. Part of this, I think is because in FotR this verse looks to going out on an adventure and then coming home again. It ends on a cheerier note than in movie RotK, which ends with the fading at the end of the journey.

[Kath]

don’t you think Pippin’s mood would have affected how it sounded?

That is a good point but we have never really seen any indication that Pippin is a master songwriter, he sings a lot but only well known songs. And mood might make it slower and sadder but still not change the underlying meaning or feeling of the song.

[Mithalwen]

But the same words can take on even opposite meanings depending on context.

Think about the phrase "I'm coming to get you"... a death threat or a promise of rescue.

Even a familiar song - perhaps a especially an old song could take a different significance in a new environment.

[Kath]

Yes but its more the tune that confuses me. Any words can be ambiguous but that is why you have a tune to combat that confusion.

[davem]

I wonder if Tolkien had a specific tune in mind for this song. On the recordings he made in the fifties he sang Sam's Troll Song to the tune of 'A fox went out on a winter's night'.

As an aside, it took me a while to realise that Bilbo's song of Earendel fits the tune of 'I am the very model of a modern major general' (from Pirates of Penzance) perfectly.

[Mithalwen]

But there may be more than one tune to many songs. And they don't always fit the mood. It may be a question of age and taste but I don't think that say, all of the Donald Swann settings really fit the Tolkien poems he sets - I invariably prefer the Stephen Oliver settings which seems to have given more thought to context. Or maybe it is the interpretation too that matters - think of the difference between Judy Garlands "over the rainbow" and Eva Cassidy's - or more painfully Will Young's "Light my Fire" compared to Jim Morrisson's. William Elvin just sounds too robust and jolly throughout - yet Swann's faltering rendition of "Bilbo's Last Song" I find very moving.

Similarly I found Billy Boyd's song very moving while I had never been particularly struck by that poem.... so was it the tune or the interpretation. Hmm.....

Oh Davem .. I am glad I never cared much for Bilbo's song of Earendil (althought I am rather fond of G&S) or you would have ruined it for me ..... Emily Dickinson's " A cetain slant of light ..." was one of my all time favourite poems until someone told me that most of Emily Dickinson can be sung to "The yellow rose of texas" ... experiment at your peril..... it has blighted my life.. ;)

http://www.niehs.nih.gov/kids/lyrics/yellowrose.htm

http://eir.library.utoronto.ca/rpo/display/poem2636.html

[Guinevere]

But the same words can take on even opposite meanings depending on context.

The verses become only ambiguous or even change in meaning because in the movie the lines that refer to coming home:

Then world behind and home ahead,
We'll wander back to home and bed.
and
Fire and lamp, and meat and bread,
And then to bed! And then to bed!

are left out!

I didn't recognize where the words of Pippin's song came from for a long time, because the mood is so very different from the original walking song.

[Kath]

Guinevere you make a great point with the word changing thing, except that it was kinda my original question. Were the words changed to change the tone of the song? Seeing the answers here I think the answer now is yes.

[Guinevere]

Were the words changed to change the tone of the song?
I think so too. They were looking for something for Pippin to sing before Denethor . In this situation something cheerful wouldn't have been fitting.

[Estelyn Telcontar]

Pippin's song was a cover version! We have similar things being done today, and sometimes a new version of the same song will sound completely different and fresh. The same song could be a march or a lullaby, depending on how it's sung, and a soloist who likes to improvise will embellish the notes - that's a good tradition in both classical music, especially of the Baroque age, and in jazz. The song was well done and appropriate for the occasion, so I have no problem with Pippin's changed version.