PDA

View Full Version : The eagles


Barrel Rider
02-21-2001, 07:58 PM
<font face="Verdana"><table><TR><TD><FONT SIZE="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Newly Deceased
Posts: 10</TD><TD></TD></TR></TABLE>
i havent gone back to cheack the books but i was wondering why didnt the eagles just take the hobbits or hobbit to mount doom and drop off the ring? they took them back to minas tirith allright

</p>

Gilthalion
02-21-2001, 08:35 PM
<font face="Verdana"><table><TR><TD><FONT SIZE="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Animated Skeleton
Posts: 38</TD><TD><img src=http://www.geocities.com/robertwgardner2000/lotrmap.gif WIDTH=60 HEIGHT=60></TD></TR></TABLE>
Re: The eagles

well, i think the eagles only had to bring the hobbits as far as ithilien, if that far, maybe only back behind the lines at the gates. not looking at a map, but I'm not sure if it's much farther from the one to another.

the eagles are special to Manwe. it could be that the eye of Sauron marked the flight of eagles if ever they passed over Mordor. Much better, perhaps, to wear an elven cloak and slip along the rough terrain.



<center> ~~~http://www.geocities.com/robertwgardner2000My Bare Bones Webpage</a>~~~ </center></p>

Suldaledhel
02-22-2001, 07:02 AM
<font face="Verdana"><table><TR><TD><FONT SIZE="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Wight
Posts: 183</TD><TD><img src=http://bestanimations.com/Fantasy/Mages/Druid-01.gif WIDTH=60 HEIGHT=60></TD></TR></TABLE>
<img src="http://www.barrowdowns.com/images/posticons/bluepal.jpg" align=absmiddle> Re: The eagles

Yes Im sure it was less noticeable (thereby more productive) to go by land.. even though it wouldve been quicker, eagles carrying people through the land stands out just a little bit <img src=smile.gif ALT=":)">
edit: missed out a word or two.. heh dont crucify me red!! <img src=wink.gif ALT=";)">

-Sūldal ~ "See, half-brother! This is sharper than thy tounge. Try but once more to usurp my place and the love of my father, and maybe it will rid the Noldor of one who seeks to be master of thralls." -Feanor to Fingolfin- -=I may be found merrymaking at <a href=http://www.barrowdowns.com/>The Barrow Downs</a>=- </p>Edited by: <A HREF=http://www.barrowdowns.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_profile&u=00000118>Suldaledhel</A>&nbsp; <IMG SRC=http://www.bestanimations.com/Nature/Fire/Flames/Flame-06.gif BORDER=0 WIDTH=10 HEIGHT=10> at: 2/22/01 8:04:42 am

Mithadan
02-22-2001, 08:11 AM
<font face="Verdana"><table><TR><TD><FONT SIZE="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Spirit of Mist
Posts: 633</TD><TD></TD></TR></TABLE>
Re: The eagles

Also, Sauron had his own aerial defenses, the Nazgul. If eagles were used, they could have been intercepted, and, as commented above, a flight of eagles approaching Mordor would have been very noticable.

--Mithadan--
"The Silmarils with living light
were kindled clear, and waxing bright
shone like stars that in the North
above the reek of earth leap forth." </p>

Sharkū
02-22-2001, 08:13 AM
<font face="Verdana"><table><TR><TD><FONT SIZE="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Hungry Ghoul
Posts: 698</TD><TD><img src=http://www.tolkiens-legacy.de/nosferatu.gif WIDTH=60 HEIGHT=60></TD></TR></TABLE>
Re: The eagles

Yes, you could not have ended WWII by parachuting assassins into the Führerbunker, could you <img src=wink.gif ALT=";)">

<h6>Ah, listen to them... the children of the night... what sweet music they make...</h6></p>

The Barrow-Wight
02-22-2001, 08:25 AM
<font face="Verdana"><table><TR><TD><FONT SIZE="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Wraith of Angmar
Posts: 1908</TD><TD></TD></TR></TABLE>
Re: The eagles

Though the eagles saved the day more than once, they were noted as 'cowardly' (in The Hobbit) if not evil. The great eagles of Middle-Earth were most often content to sit in their eyries and seldom did anything at the bidding of others.

The Barrow-Wight (RKittle)
<font size="2">I usually haunt http://www.barrowdowns.comThe Barrow-Downs</a> and The Barrow-Downs http://www.barrowdowns.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgiMiddle-Earth Discussion Board</a>.</p>

Odysseus819
02-22-2001, 08:51 AM
<font face="Verdana"><table><TR><TD><FONT SIZE="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Wight
Posts: 114</TD><TD><img src=http://images.ofoto.com/photos51/1/40/56/13/93/0/93135640103_0_SM.jpg?v=1 WIDTH=60 HEIGHT=60></TD></TR></TABLE>
Re: The eagles

It's in the nature of a deus ex machina to arrive only only in the nick of time and in times of direst need. Besides, it wouldn't be much of a story if Gwaihir simply carried Frodo and the ring to Orodruin in September 4018 !

</p>

Inziladun
02-22-2001, 11:33 AM
<font face="Verdana"><table><TR><TD><FONT SIZE="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Wight
Posts: 130</TD><TD></TD></TR></TABLE>
Re: The eagles

It would make it pretty boring if Frodo and Sam had it that easy.Tolkien thought he had already stretched the Eagles' credibility as a literary device as far as possible.He was right.

Those who will defend authority against rebellion must not themselves rebel. </p>

Aldaron
02-28-2001, 10:42 PM
<font face="Verdana"><table><TR><TD><FONT SIZE="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Pile o' Bones
Posts: 12</TD><TD></TD></TR></TABLE>
Re: The eagles

I can't add much to the direct question but it got me to thinking about eagles generally. I happen to have some Indian blood and am active on the pow-wow trail so eagles are very important to me. I was just reading the other night in the Silmarillion and read of the men, Hurin and Huor who were carried into Gondolin by eagles, and carried away again after some years. &quot;Then they took their leave and the eagles coming bore them away by night, and set them down in Dor-lomin before dawn.&quot;

Somewhere near this same place in the Silm we learn that an eagle scratched Sauron's face with his talons. Good bird.

So Tolkien's attitude toward the great bird changed between The Hobbit and LotR and the Silm.


</p>

Barrel Rider
03-01-2001, 09:23 PM
<font face="Verdana"><table><TR><TD><FONT SIZE="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Pile o' Bones
Posts: 11</TD><TD></TD></TR></TABLE>
thanks

yes very true, thanks for every bodys replys, there would of been no point travelling them on the eagles all the way but i was just seeing if there was a acual reason . thanks very much.

</p>

Zoe
03-02-2001, 01:07 AM
<font face="Verdana"><table><TR><TD><FONT SIZE="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Wight
Posts: 245</TD><TD></TD></TR></TABLE>
Re: thanks

To answer the original question: Because Sauron would have expected that.

In the mind of Sauron, everyone wants power. Thus, it's a surprise to him that Gandalf et al want to destroy the Ring at all. It's even more of a surprise to him that two hobbits would sneak through Mordor with the Ring - after all, if they were caught, it'd be curtains for everyone.

Using eagles would be, as everyone said, far too obvious. And besides, what would be the the point of the novel if Frodo could just catch a lift down to Mordor, dump the Ring, and then leave?

</p>

Gilthalion
03-02-2001, 06:11 AM
<font face="Verdana"><table><TR><TD><FONT SIZE="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Haunting Spirit
Posts: 60</TD><TD><img src=http://home.att.net/~robertwgardner/lotrmap.gif WIDTH=60 HEIGHT=60></TD></TR></TABLE>
Re: thanks

It's a fine question, actually.

We want our fantasy to be self-consistant. We accept elves and wizards and gigantic talking eagles, but we have to insist that it hangs together as a story.

In drama this is called &quot;the willing suspension of disbelief.&quot; It is what allows you to get lost in the story, so to speak.

When a bad television writer (redundant, I know) suddenly puts some jarring, out of place, sequence in the story, ruining our experience, we tend to lose interest in the show.

Likewise, if even a fantasy does not &quot;make sense,&quot; we find ourselves wondering about this and that, and not enjoying the story. Tolkien's attention to detail, and his deep understanding, and his brilliant descriptions, make his stories quite enjoyable and easy to escape into.



<center> ~~~http://www.geocities.com/robertwgardner2000My Bare Bones Webpage</a>~~~ </center></p>

enep
03-02-2001, 06:20 PM
<font face="Verdana"><table><TR><TD><FONT SIZE="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Shade of Carn Dūm
Posts: 394</TD><TD><img src=http://www.dodgywebsite.homestead.com/files/Kungfu_01.gif WIDTH=60 HEIGHT=60></TD></TR></TABLE>
Re: thanks

Good post, Gil! And all good points. I don't know if this has been pointed out, but wasn't the journey to Oroduin a test of the Ringbearer's Will or something along those lines? Correct me if I am mistaken.

The story would have been indeed a lesser epic and rather a description of flight if the Eagles had gone all that way...and rarely did Eagles take mortals far at that. Remember, Gwaihir <img src=wink.gif ALT=";)"> would only take Gandalf and the Dwarves (+ 1 hobbit) to the fields beyond the Carrock - he did not take them to Erebor, which poses a similar question. Again, Gwaihir would only take Gandalf from Isengard for a certain while before Shadowfax had to take over...Eagles were relatively separate, and although loyal to the cause against evil only came in dire times...the battle outside the Black Gate, Battle of the Five Armies etc.

- enep</p>

burrahobbit
03-02-2001, 06:45 PM
<font face="Verdana"><table><TR><TD><FONT SIZE="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Hidden Spirit
Posts: 644</TD><TD></TD></TR></TABLE>
Re: thanks

They'e almost as bad as Elrond! Lazy lazy lazy.

What's a burrahobbit got to do with my pocket, anyways?</p>