Is Arwen A Princess?

[Meela]

I have seen Arwen stated as an elf princess in many reviews, and I was wondering if this was technically correct, as I don't recall Elrond being a king, unless there's something I've missed.

[Manwe Sulimo]

Let's see if I can remember this correctly.

Arwen <-- Elrond <--Elwing <--Dior <--Lúthien <--Thingol

-and-

Arwen <--Elrond <--Eärendil <--Idril <--Turgon

So, technically, Arwen is a princess, of both Doriath and Gondolin (if they still existed).

But, of course, she's a Queen now.

[Legolas]

She's not a princess as in daughter of a king or queen.

[Beren87]

I'd give her the title of Lady, before that of princess. Elrond was after all, a Lord. Although, he was called that more just out of respect than anything. But a Lord is the proper form of address for a marquis, an earl, or a viscount. And, althought Elrond was appointed as one by a King or Queen, he did consider himself a lord of his realm, it was hardly large enough to be considered a kingdom after all.

[Sophia the Thunder Mistress]

Yeah, I'd go with Beren on that one. Aragorn's not a prince even though he's the heir to a royal line, so Arwen's not necessarily a princess because she's descended from the rulers of both the Noldor and the Teleri (although that's impressive lineage smilies/wink.gif).

[Noldorin King]

Well, she might not be but she came from the noblest kin of Man and Elves...Elrond's mother, Elwing, was one and so was Luthien her grandmother...Elrond's father was Earendil, a prince of Gondolin and his grandfather was a Noldorin prince and king of Gondolin...Arwen's mother was a daughter of a Noldor princess, Galadriel and a prince of Doriath, Celeborn...While Galadriel's parents were both children of Elven kings, it would be very hard to tell that Arwen wasn't a princess...
Note: Finduilas was a princess while Idril and Aredhel weren't and both the fathers of the latter became Highking of the nOldor...

[Elennar Starfire]

Well...

Ar=noble
wen=feminine ending

so
Arwen=lady

The translation of 'princess' is aranel.
(I am fairly sure of this, please correct me if I'm wrong!)

[Elfchick7]

Um... I believe that Arwen means noble Lady. According to the transaltion of the writing on Hadafang(Her sword). I could be wrong though. smilies/wink.gif

[Arwen1858]

Arwen means noble lady, but that doesn't mean she's not a princess.

[Elfchick7]

Oh, I agree. By noble I meant it in the sense of having a noble personality not in the sense of nobility.

[Arwen1858]

Elfchick, can you recieve private messages? I was going to send you one, but couldn't find a way to do it. Just wondered!
Arwen

[Niluial]

Well I looked up in a Tolkien Encyclopaedia and it says she is a princess of Rivendell. Arwen was the daughter of Elrond (half-elven) and Queen Celebrian. So that doesn’t really make her a princess of the King because technically Elrond was not a born prince, Celebrian was the born princess…

Niluial

[ September 30, 2003: Message edited by: Niluial ]

[lore_master]

well arwens mother, celebrain, was princess of lothlorien, her grand mother was queen, since celebrain went to the west doesnt that make Arwen heir to the throne of lorien, after Galadriel, and celeborn?

[Niluial]

since celebrain went to the west doesnt that make Arwen heir to the throne of lorien, after Galadriel, and celeborn? Well yes she did become Queen but she became Aragorn’s queen therefore through this marriage she chose to share the ultimate fate of all mortals.

~Niluial

[ September 30, 2003: Message edited by: Niluial ]

[Legolas]

Celebrian was not a Queen, nor was Galadriel. She was simple Lady of Lorien just as Celeborn was Lord.

[Lumiel]

*GASP!!!*

Of course she's a princess!

She's a Pretty Princess! (take that Disney)


I'm obsessed with Arwen, people actually call me Arwen...yeah, weird I know.

Sorry, had to stick in my worthless two cents here.

[kittygirl02]

Yes, she is a princess because Galadriel and Celeborn were her grandparents,and Galadriel was/is an Elf queen. So, technicly,yes.

[kittygirl02]

Okay, forget what I just said because I forgot. Celeborn(or his alter ego Celebrian) were just a lord and lady of Rivendell.

[Silmiel of Imladris]

I am a princess, all girls are! Even if they live in tiny old attics, even if they dress in rags, even if they aren't pretty, or smart or young, we're still princesses, all of us. ~ Sara, A Little Princess
Thats all I have to say on this subject. smilies/biggrin.gif

[kittygirl02]

I absolutly adore that qoute and love the book and movie. It brings tears to my eyes whenever I read it. god is king, and we are all his children, and, yes, we are all princes and princesess.

[Jack]

Hi Kitty girl, I agree with you and Silmiel of Imladris!

[kittygirl02]

Oh, thank you. smilies/smile.gif
Have a nice day! And I'll try to too.

[Cibbwin]

I agree with Beren87, Elrond is the "Lord of the Last Homely House", so I would call Arwen a Lady before anything.

'Sides, the word "princess" has been so Disney-atized to me that I loathe the word. :P

[kittygirl02]

No, litarally.

[lady evenstar]

well arwen technically is a princess because she is the daughter of elrond who is the son of Elwing who is the daughter of King Dior who is the son of Luthien who is the daughter of Melian the Maia, queen of the Doriath. So there you have it. I did some studying on this.

[Legolas]

Not really. Doriath fell (and sank with Beleriand) and the Sindar dissassembled - established their own colonies in Middle-earth, mixing with the Silvan, and/or left Middle-earth for Aman. Dior's line ended with his sons dying in the Ruin of Doriath as well as his kingdom. Elwing was no longer a princess of Doriath after that, nor was Elrond a prince, nor was Arwen a princess.

[Lasgalen]

Why does Elwing stop being a princess because Doriath fell? These titles are inherited and don't depend on land.

[Orofaniel]

Elennar wrote:
Ar=noble
wen=feminine ending

so
Arwen=lady

The translation of 'princess' is aranel.
(I am fairly sure of this, please correct me if I'm wrong!)

Well, the transelation of princess is 'aranel' in Quenya.

I think of Arwen as a lady. I have nothing more to add, because Beren87, Sophia and Legolas have said it all already. smilies/smile.gif

[Orald]

A king rules over a kingdom, without a kingdom there isn't really a king.

As for Aranel. Aran- means King, but only King of a specified region. The same goes for the Ar- stem.