Tolkien's best Dragon

[littlemanpoet]

Which do you think is Tolkien's best Dragon:
Ancalagon the Black, Glaurung, Scatha, Smaug, or Chrysophylax (Farmer Giles of Ham)?

[ May 14, 2002: Message edited by: littlemanpoet ]

[ May 14, 2002: Message edited by: littlemanpoet ]

[Gayalondiel]

Well, I don't know Chrysophylax, but from the others i'd say Smaug. Maybe i'm biased cos he's the first one i knew, but he has more character than the others, and he was intelligent too, he understood Bilbo's riddling. (ok, so there was the hole in his armour, but otherwise he was smart!) Plus he's more traditionally dragonish than the others, hoardes of gold etc etc. (Dragons are a favourite of mine, no matter what i'm reading. If only they were real...) smilies/wink.gif

[obloquy]

Glaurung, definitely. I haven't read Farmer Giles, and I barely consider Smaug a 'canon' character, due to the nature of The Hobbit. Glaurung's malice was just chilling.

[Rohirrim]

I think that for me, the best is Smaug.

[Kuruharan]

Of those you listed Chrysophylax because he's so funny.

But in Middle earth I'd have to say that Glaurung had the most personality.
If only they were real...
Are you insane? smilies/wink.gif

Everybody who hasn't read Farmer Giles of Ham needs to do so ASAP. It's a laugh riot. smilies/biggrin.gif

[Keeper of Dol Guldur]

I'd have to say Scatha the Worm. He must have been pretty important since all of the northerners, and Grey Mountain dwarves wanted a piece of him.

[aeglaer]

I would say that Glaurung, the actual first dragon of Midlle Earth, he dominated the mind of Túrin Turambar, one of the greatest dark heroes of The Silmarillion, he could have been father to a line of Half elves, just as Tuor, Glaurung is great because he shows a sign of nobility that few dragons have, he´s the king, just that.

[obloquy]

Scatha's a nobody. We've got about one paragraph of information on him and that's it. That's not indicative of a 'great' dragon. Dwarves wanted his hoard? Big deal, Dwarves want everyone's hoard.

[Gorin Icearms]

I'd have to say it's a draw between Smaug and Chrysophylax. They are really the only 2 dragons that have depth to their personality. All the other dragons are usually just described as cunning and evil. Smaug for example enjoyed riddles, town-baiting, and eating maidens. smilies/biggrin.gif Chrysophylax was a "cunning, inquisitive, greedy (no suprise there), well armored but not overly bold dragon."

He and Smaug were the only 2 (that I know of) that have a real personality.


*Oops, heh. I forgot about Glaurung. smilies/biggrin.gif

[ March 13, 2002: Message edited by: Gorin Icearms ]

[Ahanarion]

Glaurung the Golden father of all dragons. The question is who is the mother?

[Orald]

Ancalagon is only mentioned in the War of Wrath, so the amount of lines concerning each dragon does not necessarily denote how great they are. The lines from War of Wrath read as thus:

Then, seeing that his hosts were overthrown and his power dispersed, Morgoth quailed, and he dared not to come forth himself. But he loosed upon his foes the last desperate assault that he had prepared, and out of the pits of Angband there issued the winged dragons, that had not before been seen; and so sudden and ruinous was the onset of that dreadful fleet that the host of the Valar was driven back, for the coming of the dragons was with great thunder, and lightning, and a tempest of fire.
But Eärendil came, shining with white flame, and about Vingilot were gathered all the great birds of heaven and Thorondor was their captain, and there was battle in the air all the day and through a dark night of doubt. Before the rising of the sun Eärendil slew Ancalagon the Black, the mightiest of the dragon-host, and cast him from the sky; and he fell upon the towers of Thangorodrim, and they were broken in his ruin.

Now that is a pretty big dragon that can crush the peaks of Thangorodrim. Plus it does say he was the mightiest of the dragon-host, and in the mightiest of the winged-dragons.

[Gayalondiel]

Are you insane?
yes i am, very much so smilies/biggrin.gif I'd LOVE a pet dragon, just a little one of my own that'll grow up to love me... and scare the neighbours... and ensure that i never get mugged ever again. smilies/wink.gif

[Rosa Underhill]

Chrysophylax is a riot but I still like Smaug the best. He scared me and that's not easy to do. smilies/smile.gif He was just so...creepy yet so cool!

[obloquy]

Did you read the little bit on Scatha, Durelan? Apparently he had a hoard.

Ancalagon appeared in a battle as the mightiest of the dragon-host. Big difference.

[Keeper of Dol Guldur]

true, little is mentioned, but I'd bet that the tales of Smeagols people, and the Rohirrim and Northmen told a mighty tale. Plus, all the other dragons were talked about too much.

[Keeper of Dol Guldur]

Maybe because they were actually important...but Scatha I imagined looking like the Craw wurm from Magic:The Gathering.

[obloquy]

Well, I guess those non-existant tales do make Scatha Tolkien's 'best' Dragon. What do you think littlemanpoet meant by 'best'? Surely it wasn't "which one could have been the coolest if someone had told really cool stories about him." You just thought it would be neat to mention a Dragon that most people appropriately pay little attention to. It's like declaring that Garulf was the Rohirrim's best horseman.

[Kuruharan]

It's like declaring that Garulf was the Rohirrim's best horseman.
smilies/biggrin.gif LOL! smilies/biggrin.gif

yes i am, very much so I'd LOVE a pet dragon, just a little one of my own that'll grow up to love me... and scare the neighbours... and ensure that i never get mugged ever again.
Hmm...doesn't sound like a half bad idea now that you mention it.

[Orald]

Obloquy, I agree that Scatha isn't the biggest baddest shut yo mouth in Middle-Earth, I am just saying there could have been another dragon not even mentioned, that was stronger than one like Smaug.

I did not Mention Ancalagon first, twas LittleManPoet and if you were referring to Scatha, well, I did not mention him at all. http://www.plauder-smilies.de/splat.gif smilies/wink.gif

[littlemanpoet]

What a riot. Glad I asked this one. smilies/biggrin.gif

Thanks, Keeper of Dol Guldur, for adding Scatha to the list. I'd forgotten about him.

By "best" I meant whatever number of traits you think makes the best dragon.

Chrysophylax gets my vote. Gorin Icearms' quote summarizes why. And if you don't know Chrysophylax, read Farmer Giles of Ham. It's the laugh-riotest thing. smilies/biggrin.gif

So far the tally is:
Smaug: 3 1/2 votes
Glaurung: 3 votes
Chrysophylax: 2 1/2 votes
Scatha: 1 vote
Anacalagon: 1 vote

Anti-votes: 1 against Scatha. Did I miss any?

[ March 30, 2002: Message edited by: littlemanpoet ]

[obloquy]

I wasn't talking to you, Durelan. smilies/smile.gif I happen to value your posts and I am glad you hang around the advanced boards.

[ March 15, 2002: Message edited by: obloquy ]

[Belegfanaion]

I don't have ANY explanation, so don't ask (watch, everybody'll ask just cuz I said that!) but my favorite Dragon was Smaug. smilies/tongue.gif

[Dior]

All you people who put Smaug are crazy. I mean, he was slain by a single arrow(I don't care if it was a sacred black one), and what did he do but take over Erebor?

Also, notice the people who have the most experience say Glaurung. I place my vote alongside.

[Nazgûl Queen]

<center><font color="red">I love all the dragons but I'd have to say Ancalagon because he is so big and black and powerful and can fly...

At one of my other boards I got a Dragon Egg which is going to hatch into a black dragon... I have christened him "Ancalagon" smilies/biggrin.gif

[Maikadilwen]

Yup, I too would say Ancalagon or Glaurung. Smaug is.....just cute. smilies/rolleyes.gif smilies/biggrin.gif

[Nar]

I have to go with Chrysophylax-- he has the most winning personality. Aside from being witty and clever, he's a sensible peace-loving coward-- if I actually encountered a dragon, that's exactly what I'd want in him (or her)-- so I'd survive the encounter! Furthermore, Chrysophylax ends up far more politically enlightened than the others, although this enlightenment is mainly owing to the business end of Farmer Giles' blunderbuss. He teams up with Giles, a member of the farming class, thereby enabling a populist hero to take the kingship. All those other dragons serve elitist tyrants. Only Chrysophylax is a good socialist dragon.

[ April 27, 2002: Message edited by: Nar ]

[Marileangorifurnimaluim]

I've always liked Ancalagon the Black, ever since I read Gandalf's mention of him in "The Shadow of the Past." A blast that could destroy even the rings of power (if not the one ring) - wow.

But personality-wise I like Smaug's cool intelligent arrogance the best. Glaurung is chilling, but petty in his mean-spiritness.

[Eglaquelleiel the elf]

I like ancalagon the black the most im not sure why ,but any way smaugs arrogance and not much brains but intelligent make him interseting but vague.


---------------------

one by one they take flight and above their
wings gold lays

[Rinurion]

Ancalagon the black was probably the most powerful of the dragons, due to his size, the fact he could fly, and the heat of his flames (id fancy him taiking out quite a few balrogs smilies/wink.gif).
But as for personality... well, id have to give that to smaug... as tolkien went to lengths to give us a good picture of him in the hobbit.

[shadowstalker]

All of you are CRAZY!!! Ancalagon the Black is by far the COOLEST dragon to ever exist!!! I mean, Ancalagon could have won the War of the Ring easily, if he hadn't been killed. He was big, mean, and nasty. smilies/evil.gif I'll admit that Scatha and Glaurung were cool, too. But Ancalagon was the best. Oh, and Smaug was a wuss to be killed dso easily.

[littlemanpoet]

Latest tally:
Smaug: 5 1/2
Glaurung: 4 1/2
Chrysophylax: 3 1/2 (thanks Nar) since I started this I get an extra vote: 4 1/2 nya nya nya smilies/biggrin.gif
Scatha: 1 (still)
Ancalagon: 5 1/2 (like a late breaking horse)

It's Smaug and Ancalagon neck and neck with Glaurung one length back and Chrysophylax two lengths back and Scatha has stopped to smell the roses...

[Feanor...]

All the best reasons have already been put out so let me make it simple. ANCALAGON THE BLACK!!!!! smilies/biggrin.gif

[doug*platypus]

My vote goes to Glaurang, for sheer malevolent evil.

Smaug the Magnificent was a great character, and not just a slimy groundworm, but what did he really achieve? Not as much as Big G. Not as much evil or horror. They're only Dwarves, after all!

Favourite name: Scatha the Worm.

Special mention: Ancalagon the Black, winner of the All Hype award.

Chrysophylax was just a little bit too reasonable. I like Tolkien's dragons because they are incarnations of great evil, as I think dragons should be. Not prissy little things with people flying around on their backs. Or something called Norbert.

[Aragost]

Tolkien's best dragon was Smaug. Most dragons had a soft underside. Smaug had strong armor on his stomache with the exeption of the small hole in the upper left part.

Cold Drakes were also really cool.

[Inderjit Sanghera]

Ancalagon. He was said to be the greatest dragon ever-Smaug was a *****cat compared to him. Glaurung was O.K, if a bit overweight. smilies/wink.gif

[ January 16, 2003: Message edited by: Inderjit Sanghera ]

[Sapphire_Flame]

The best dragon is Smaug, hands down!! He has a fiery (haha) personality, and is the first one I read about, so I might be biased. *And* he's red, and red is the best color. One whole vote for Smaug right here!!!!!!

Oh, and I give half a vote to Chrysophylax, 'cause he's cool too. If you haven't read Farmer Giles of Ham, do so now!!!!

Also, add me to the list of peeps who wants a pet dragon!!! Kudos to Dragon-lovers!!!!

[ January 17, 2003: Message edited by: Sapphire_Flame ]

[Hilde Bracegirdle]

Add another vote for Glaurung.

[littlemanpoet]

smilies/biggrin.gif Hee hee! What fun. Hokay doke. Latest tally:

Smaug: 7 1/2
Glaurung: 6
Chrysophylax: 3 1/2
Scatha: 1
Ancalagon: 7 1/2

It's Smaug and Ancalagon neck and neck with Glaurung a length and a half behind....

[Galadrie1]

I can't let my dear Chrysophylax down. My vote's for him. Alas! If I'd only read Farmer Giles sooner I'd have a much cooler nickname here at the 'Downs. smilies/frown.gif

Could I also get half a vote in for Smaug?

EDIT: What a not-very-funny coincidence: my votes are the reverse of Sapphire's.

[ January 17, 2003: Message edited by: Galadrie1 ]

[Inderjit Sanghera]

No. It should be one vote each. I vote for Ancalagon. *Hopes no one notices his previous vote* smilies/wink.gif

[GreatWarg]

My vote is cast for Glaurung, I must say. I would consider him cruel, and he played a large part in the curse that Morgoth laid upon Turin.

A few words for Smaug, however; I do not cast a half vote for him, but I will say this: he was, if anything, an amusing character in my eye, and one who is overly obsessed with his hoarde.

GreatWarg

[obloquy]

I vote for Scatha.

[radagast]

Chrysophylax was Tolkien's best Dragon. He's my favorite, thouh Smaug's is easier to pronounce. ;-)

[littlemanpoet]

Welcome to the Downs, radagast, and a very sensible first post, I might add. smilies/biggrin.gif

[Thulorongil]

I haven't read of Chrysophylax, though it seems now I'm going to have to.

I'd have to say Glaurung. He was the father of all the dragons, and was such a cunning & powerful beast. But mostly, he was cool!

I think that tons of people would be thinking of Smaug, only because he's the one everyone knows about.

[zacattack]

Tolkeins best Dragon in my opinion is Ancalagon the Black.Glaurung is the father of Dragons and he's pretty cool but I still like Ancalagon better.

[littlemanpoet]

Thorongil: Maybe your vote will change after you've read Farmer Giles. I think you'll love it.

Smaug: 7 1/2
Glaurung: 8
Chrysophylax: 5 1/2
Scatha: 2
Ancalagon: 8 1/2

Ancalagon pulls away from Smaug but Glaurung slithers a neck ahead of Smaug, too, catching up to Ancalagon. Whoa! And look at ol' Chrysophylax, where'd he find that extra kick! Must have smelled unguarded treasure at the finish line....

[Inderjit Sanghera]

So whens the deadline for voting?

[obloquy]

Yeah, and when will the winners be announced? And what are the prizes?

[A Dwarf Friend]

I dont remember his name but the one in the Hobbit

[Inderjit Sanghera]

Smaugs the name and now he is level with Angy and Glaurung. As for prizes. A dragon maybe?

[littlemanpoet]

From my view they're only on the back straightaway...

As for prizes, what prize do you give a dragon?

[Inderjit Sanghera]

Gold? Jewels? Mithril? A chicken mcnugget?

[Tinuviel of Denton]

I like Chrysophylax and all those others, but my vote has to go to Smaug because I'm currently in a play version of "the Hobbit" and where would I be without loyalty.
(By the way, add me to the list of people who want a dragon and for real dragonlovers, check out the Elvenbane series. The dragons are the principle characters.)

[Daewen]

Smaug, definetly, because he has an interesting personality and he was, for a dragon, civil to Bilbo.

[The Saucepan Man]

My vote definately goes to Glaurung. I like my Dragons evil, and Glaurung's just about as evil as they get. OK, he hasn't got the overbearing winged power of Ancalagon the Black, or the smug arrogance of Smaug. But for sheer, unrelenting malevolence, Glaurung beats them all hands down.

Indeed, Ancalagon wouldn't even make the shortlist for me, given that he couldn't even see out his first engagement in battle without getting himself slayed. Glaurung, on the other hand, hung around for thousands of years making the lives of Elves and Men alike (and the family of Hurin in particular) a misery.

Smaug comes a close second. But after his onslaught on the Dwarves of the Lonely Mountain and the Men of Dale, he became more concerned with protecting his pile of treasure than rampaging about like a proper Dragon should. And, becoming overly-confident in his arrogance, he allowed himself to be easily tricked into revealing his vulnerable spot. In order to defeat Glaurung, however, Turin had to come up with a very clever, and highly risky, strategy. And even when he lay dying, Glaurung was unrepentant, preferring instead to further the malice that he had wrought:

Hail, Nienor, daughter of Hurin. We meet again ere the end. I give thee joy that thou hast found thy brother at last. And now thou shalt know him: a stabber in the dark, treacherous to foes, faithless to friends, and a curse unto his kin. Turin son of Hurin! But the worst of all his deeds thou shalt feel in thyself.

Now that's what I call a proper Draconian way to behave. smilies/evil.gif smilies/cool.gif smilies/biggrin.gif

[Aiwendil]

I vote for Glaurung - the perfect combination of malice, cunning, brute strength, and evil will. Smaug is a great character as well, but somehow Glaurung seems to me to be more intense, more starkly and dramatically drawn.

[Dain]

Glaurung definitely was an evil wyrm, and I'm sure Ancalagon the black was very powerful, but just for this comment:
They're only Dwarves, after all!
I'll have to vote for Smaug the Magnificent, if only because he ruined the fortunes of my people for centuries. Anyway, Glaurung couldn't even fly!

[Tinuviel the Nightingale]

Ancalagon the Black all the way.

[Nuranar]

Glaurung, on the other hand, hung around for thousands of years making the lives of Elves and Men alike (and the family of Hurin in particular) a misery.

Attaboy - er, Man smilies/biggrin.gif - Saucepan! Malevolent, malicious, malignant, merciless, murderous, monstrous, maleficent...who needs wings?

[Mitheithel]

I like Acalagon the Black, though the guy in "Farmer Giles of Ham" was extremely funny
smilies/biggrin.gif

[littlemanpoet]

I'm glad to see new life breathed into this particularly enjoyable discussion. Allow me to raise the ante... thusly:

Everybody seems to think that since we're comparing Tolkien's dragons to Tolkien's dragons, that it's apples to apples, so to speak. But The Silmarillion is quite a different book from The Hobbit, and Farmer Giles of Ham is quite different from either of the other two. Thus, one may conceivably compare Ancalagon the Black and Glaurung without having to account for legendarious (new word, eh? smilies/smile.gif ) differences, but Smaug's milieu is that of a classic fairy tale with its happy ending, whereas Glaurung's is of mythic scope, and tragic. By comparison, Chrysophylax's milieu is unabashed farce. So...

Given the farcical underpinnings of Chrysophylax and the happy ending underpinnings of Smaug, and the mythic tragedy underpinnings of Glaurung, a lot of the arguments raised in defense of this one or that being best, is mitigated by these very underpinnings. Thus, Smaug letting Bilbo discover his weakness is part of the nature of fairy tale, and is not as valid a mark against him as Ancalagon losing his first battle. There are probably many more examples of just such a thing.

All of this to say, given the farcical nature of Farmer Giles of Ham, all the mitigations therein accounted for, such as Chrysophylax being a groveling, treasure loving sycophant set aside, his sheer wrath at the stupid giant, and cleverness at all times, not to mention his ability to stay alive in the face Caudimordax, Chrysophylax, is clearly the best dragon. Of course, I've already voted, so this is redundant. But necessary. smilies/biggrin.gif

[Afrodal Fenyar]

Ancalagon the Black's pretty cool, simply because he is great, but my vote goes to Glaurung. Why? It's already said here. I need not to add anything.

[The Saucepan Man]

Thus, one may conceivably compare Ancalagon the Black and Glaurung without having to account for legendarious (new word, eh? ) differences, but Smaug's milieu is that of a classic fairy tale with its happy ending, whereas Glaurung's is of mythic scope, and tragic. By comparison, Chrysophylax's milieu is unabashed farce.

Ah, but they stand or fall by the style in which they are written. So a perceived fault derived from their legendarious (great word, lmp smilies/smile.gif ) setting (such as Samug's weak spot) is nevetheless a valid fault for the person casting the vote. smilies/wink.gif

By my calculations, the scoreboard currently stands at:

Smaug: 11 1/2
Glaurung: 12
Chrysophylax: 5 1/2
Scatha: 2
Ancalagon: 10 1/2

So, Ancalagon drops from first to third, while Glaurung (yay! smilies/biggrin.gif ) takes the lead, with Smaug in close pursuit. "Who needs wings" indeed. smilies/tongue.gif

[Sophia the Thunder Mistress]

Glaurung made Turin's life a wreck, and since I am quite fond of Turin in his better moments, I can never quite forgive Glaurung for it. So while he's quite good as dragons go, my vote goes for the far end of the spectrum and.... *drumroll*

Chrysophylax- an excellent dragon, and an excellent cook (as represented in Revenge of the Entish Bow smilies/wink.gif-- almost as funny as the original)

Sophia

[littlemanpoet]

:Sniff!: Excuse me as I :sniff: in indignation that such a nonentity as Ancalagon has so many votes compared to the ever wondrous Chrysophylax! smilies/mad.gif

It seems to me there should be somewhere around here .... :: LMP peers around his mug of ale :: ... Ah! Yes! I have here a little bit of historolexicography that proves - proves! - mind you, that Chrysophylax is indeed the greatest of Tolkien's dragons. It was brought to my attention by a very, very short man (who just happened to wear very, very large shoes). It seems that there is this ancient booklet written in a rare form of West Saxon. The book's title is somewhat smeared, and the title page is worse, but I think I can just make it out: "Annals of the Wild Hills and Legendarious Accounts of Wyrms and Giants". So you see, the word 'legendarious' cannot be said to originate with this writer, much to my own chagrin. In any case, in this singular book it says that - excuse me, the pages are ever so delicate - seems to indicate that Chyrsophylax lived long years after the shortlived incident of the Little Kingdom, and that he routed out every last giant from Wales, sent them packing north where they shrank over time and turned into - Shetland ponies? No. I read that wrong. Scottish sheepherders is what is says. The writing is somewhat smeared right there. But I'm quite certain that it says Scottish sheepherders. There's a reference to the Highlands and Loch Ness. Something about Chrysophylax enjoying a good swim now and then. What that might mean I leave to your deductions. In any case, this book makes it quite clear that Chrysophylax had a most illustrious career and is perhaps still with us to this day. I'm sorry, but he must stand as Tolkien's best dragon. And if my illustrious colleague, The Saucepan Man, Esquire, is to be granted his contention that the legendarious mitigations must be allowed to stand, then this newly discovered "Annals" book must also be included as evidence. I wish I could show it to you... Respectfully, Littlemanpoet. Now where did that verrry little man with the verrrry big shoes get to? I swear I saw him just over ... there... He seemed ... English .... somehow.... OxfordShire, perhaps? Just a guess.

[Keneldil the Polka-dot]

Glaurung for me, with Smaug a close second.

Which do you think is Tolkien's best dragon

Sounds to me like littlemanpoet is asking for opinions obloquy. So voting for Scatha is legit, however misguided, and does not merit your sarcasm (not that you ever require merit), or your second guessing.

[the guy who be short]

definitely glaurung, for all the reasons the saucepan man said. i mean, smaug was just... i dont know... he seemed weaker. i mean, he killed sheep or ponies or something didnt he? how noble and powerful is that? smilies/rolleyes.gif

[Schmendrick]

I'm gonna have to vote Glaurung, too. For me he is THE perfect dragon ; cunning, evil and mysterious...

[littlemanpoet]

'Kay, guy who be short, jush fer argumensh shake, who ever shez a drrrrragun is sh'posed te be noble? 'Scuze me while I go burry me face in me beer...

[Este]

Ancalagon the Black - blatently, he was the first flying dragonthe when he arrived he was a new and evil force theres no way you can compare smaug to to him smaug just sat on his butt all day every day for however many years, you may say 'oh but he was feared by all peoples near him' that doesnt really say much, they didnt seem to need much scaring - the people only moved away as far a esgaroth thats not a great distance, plus he was camp smilies/rolleyes.gif ... who ever heard of a camp dragon? no, Ancalagon definitly has my vote.

[Helkahothion]

Glaurung for me. Smaug was stupid, he was too arrogant and it lead to his death. The others, I don't know. What I do know is that GLaurung had much power and was golden. Well, that should be enough for me smilies/biggrin.gif

Suilad,

Anuion

[Finwe]

Ancalagon for me! Now that Dragon died in style! It took Earendil and a fleet of Eagles to kill him, not just a random guy with a black sword like Glaurung, or a random guy with a bow and arrow like Smaug!

[obloquy]

Turin's just some 'random guy'?

[Beren87]

Chrysophylax of course! The most amusing dragon in all Fantasy, beaten by a farmer. Lovely dragon, Chrysophylax.

[Yavanna228]

Heh heh, never underestimate a farmer with a mission. smilies/wink.gif
Chrysophylax gets my vote too. Although Glaurung is the more 'dragony' dragon. Chrys is endearing. Sort of.
Peace

[The Saucepan Man]

Smaug: 11 1/2
Glaurung: 16
Chrysophylax: 8 1/2
Scatha: 2
Ancalagon: 12 1/2

Glaurung now pulling away from the chasing pack. Just as it should be. smilies/tongue.gif smilies/wink.gif

[ June 25, 2003: Message edited by: The Saucepan Man ]

[StarJewel]

My vote would have to go to Glaurung. He actively sought to make Turin's, Nienor's, and anyone else's lives he came across a living hell. (Dont ya love my abuse of the good old English language?) Just for pure nastiness, he gets my vote.

Although, Ancalagon's taking out mountains was pretty coolnull (http://null) null

[Lord of Angmar]

My vote for Tolkien's best dragon goes to Glaurung. He was by far the cruelest of all the Uruloki, the father of the dragons and the epitome of all that Morgoth represented. In many ways he was the physical embodiement of Morgoth in the first age, since Morgoth never appeared from his fortress in Angband except for his battle with Fingolfin and in the War of Wrath. Glaurung's cruelty, malice and treachery, and his sheer cunning, make him the best dragon.

However, when I read about the battle between Ancalagon and Earendil, I did get chills, but there's simply not enough written about him to compare him to Glaurung. Smaug is more two-dimensional I think, since the Hobbit was (let's face it) a children's book, more so than LotR and DEFINITELY more than the Silmarillion. As for Chrysophylax, I don't think his personality was as well crafted as Glaurungs.

Shouldn't this be under Novices and Newcomers, as I am told that all "best/favorite" posts should be there? Just wondering....

Has anyone kept a running count of who has obtained the most votes of the 4 aforementioned dragons? I'm too lazy to go back and count, but my guess from skimming through entries is Glaurung.

smilies/smile.gif

[BobTheGrey]

But you have forgotten the best dragon of all Gandalf's firework smilies/tongue.gif . But seriously I don't know much about this subject but in the Shadow of the Past Gandalf seems to think Ancalagon was the most powerful (or at least the one with the best fire breath) and I suspect he knows what he's talking about.

[Helkahothion]

Gandalf did not life when Glaurung lived in Middle-Earth. Being the father of all dragons, he should be the best. It's like saying Shelob is better than Ungoliant. Not likely true either. But of course, some dragons have cooler abileties than others in someones abilety. In battle, Glaurung would kick butt if you ask me.

Abedithon le,

Anuion

*edit ooooooh, pwetty new pages

[ June 30, 2003: Message edited by: Helkahothion ]

[Lord of Angmar]

I wonder who would win if Glaurung and Ancalagon the Black fought. Ancalagon, after all, was the mightiest of the WINGED dragons, who were probably physically more powerful than the land Worms. Still, Glaurung was extremely crafty... He probably could have put a spell on Ancalagon.

[Finwe]

True, but Ancalagon could have flown up and kept harrying Glaurung from the air. Glaurung can only put spells on people/things if they look him in the eye, like what Turin and Nienor did.

[Pablo]

my vote is for glaurung,because he was the most evil,and the most cunning

[Estelyn Telcontar]

Ah, another old opinion topic has resurfaced! I'm moving it to the Novices and Newcomers forum, where we now place the "favorite" threads. Please continue to read and post there.

[The Saucepan Man]

Seemingly a convenient moment for an update on the scores:

Smaug: 11 1/2
Glaurung: 19
Chrysophylax: 8 1/2
Scatha: 2
Ancalagon: 13 1/2

Can any of the others catch Glaurung, or is it now just a one-Dragon race? smilies/wink.gif

[Silver Dragon]

I think Ancalagon was the most passable of the Tolkien Dragons I've read about...

Smaug-was just stupid (idiot dragon...showed a person he couldn't see he only weakness..was too lazy to clog up the hole in the wall...I could go on...)... smilies/redface.gif
Glaurung-did he really have nothing better to do? He went rampaging about...killed a couple armies...and his own army of orcs...felled bridges...collected a cashe of jewels/gold/precious things...would have been better if he had had wings...and died in a better way than having a sword thrust in his bloated belly...terrible way to go... smilies/mad.gif
Chrysophylax-never really finished Farmer Giles...only skimmed the first part [sorry Lhachwen...]...so I can't really say much about him... smilies/frown.gif
Scatha-don't remember anything about him (if I ever read anything about him...) smilies/frown.gif

So I guess my vote goes to Ancalagon the Black...winged dragon who was slain by a Silmaril-bearer...and a lot of big birds... smilies/rolleyes.gif

[ August 04, 2003: Message edited by: Silver Dragon ]

[Lord of Angmar]

While I agree that Ancalagon was probably the mightiest of all the dragons, I think you underrate Glaurung. He was extremely cunning, and (probably) much craftier than Ancalagon. While I'm sure he wouldn't beat the Black in a purely physical duel, his overall power rivaled that of Ancalagon because of his hypnotic powers. Give him his due credit. He was, after all, able to drive the strongest Man ever to madness and suicide.

[Silver Dragon]

Agreed on the madness/suicide part...but was the hypnotic power limited specifically to Glaurung?

[Dragon Elf odin Ragnorock]

I would have to say Smaug and Ancalagon because they had the best personality of a dragon.

[Luthien_ Tinuviel]

Well, my favorites are Glaurung and Chrysophylax.

Glaurung is just so chillingly evil. He caused so much destruction and so much despair. He really did his job as a dragon. And I think it's fascinating how he winds himself through the Narn i Hin Hurin.

Chrysophylax is funny. He could be considered as bad (he's a dragon; Tolkien dragons are bad), but he's a very interesting character.

I love dragons, so I like the others too, but these two definately hold precendence in my mind.

[Meneltarmacil]

Beyond all doubt, I think Smaug deserves the Best Dragon Award. I vote for him. Glaurung showed a lot of personality, but he couldn't fly like a "proper dragon" should. Ancalagon could fly and breathe fire and was extremely powerful but had no personality. Smaug had great lines in The Hobbit and he was really good in combat as well.

Here is the current tally:
Smaug: 13
Glaurung: 19 1/2
Chrysophylax: 9
Scatha: 2
Ancalagon: 14
(note: Dragon Elf Odin Ragnorock voted half for Smaug and half for Ancalagon, and Luthien_Tinuviel voted half for Glaurung and half for Chrysophylax)

Glaurung is still in the lead, but Ancalagon is slowly catching up with Smaug a close third. Chrysophylax is fourth and Scatha is left in the dust.

[ August 05, 2003: Message edited by: Meneltarmacil ]

[Galadrie1]

Chrysophylax-never really finished Farmer Giles...only skimmed the first part [sorry Lhachwen...]...so I can't really say much about him... Tsk tsk, you should finish it! It's good, I promise. You can burn all my hair off if you don't like it (whoa, don't ask me where I came up with that).

Still rootin' for my dear Chrysophylax,
Galad smilies/smile.gif

[ August 08, 2003: Message edited by: Galadrie1 ]

[littlemanpoet]

Up! smilies/biggrin.gif

Smaug: 13
Glaurung: 19 1/2
Chrysophylax: 9
Scatha: 2
Ancalagon: 14

Cast your vote! smilies/smile.gif Remember, everybody gets to vote just once.