Sauron in his off hours-seriously

[Keeper of Dol Guldur]

To be serious with this already mentioned subject, what would Sauron have done in his off hours. And might he look like without his evil dark lord geir and masks/helms. I think maybe he brooded a lot, and sat on his throne in deep thought. He probably had a daily look in the palantir, and when the Witch king was in, they probably had one of those generals maps with the models that are their forces, etc... Lots of war stuff. Sleep and food aren't that big of a concern, so who cares about them. But what about his looks. Tolkien illustrated a painting of Sauron at the time of his death. He was a big cloud, but his face was round shaped, with a wide, round nose. And big red eyes, his hands had claws to. I draw him as this shape with a roman nose, pointy ears, etc... since it said in the Silm that Valar look something like glorified elves, and since he's maiar, I think he's no exception. Of course he has his eyes, but as for clothes....If he didn't need his armor on, maybe black Saruman style robes, with a big collar and a cape. And the rings too. I think he has a scar on his throat from Huan as well, and maybe some red markings on his face, or red hair on deep black skin (not african origin type dark skin, but BLACK like evil, like this sites background.) Any thoughts on this?

[Elven-Maiden]

I don't think Sauron would have any off-hours. When he had a dull moment, he probably spent it trying to kill or corrupt the ring-bearer.

[Samwise]

Hm. Possibly (In those times of deep thought) making his plans for what he was going to do once he was ruler {{shiver}} of Middle-Earth?
LOTR Moment (II) (Moria)
Nine Walkers enter
Frodo's sword glows with blue light
door barred--Orcs coming!

Copyright 2002 S. Uffelman

[Eowyn of Ithilien]

no rest for the wicked
smilies/wink.gif

[Keeper of Dol Guldur]

That's right, these things (palantir, maps, etc...) are all war related anyway, but he was an artificer so maybe he carved things, or worked personally on weapons. "No rest for the wicked is right" he probably didn't sleep since the fate of his ring was unknown to him. But I definitely think he brooded alot.

[questor]

In his position I wouldn't nessesary concider brooding "off hours." Plans and strategy are not simple or useless thing. I think any time he didn't spend in action would be spent in thought about future action, so I would say he wouldn't have any "off hours."

[Samwise]

Welcome, questor and Keeper (who I can see has been around awhile, it's just that we've never "met" officially.....)

"Eavesdropping!", cried the wizard. "To punish you properly for listening, you shall go away with Frodo."
"Me Sir!", cried Sam. "Me go and see Elves and all! Hooray! "

[Lush]

You are all so innocent! You make me feel like my brain is a giant gutter. Because, frankly, when I saw the title of this post, I imagined that Sauron, if he did indeed have some freizeit, probably spent it in some den of vice, indulging evil passions. I am being perfectly serious here.

[ January 31, 2002: Message edited by: Lush ]

[Kuruharan]

Well, it's possible. Morgoth was 'interested' by Luthien so big evil Dark Lords might go for the den of evil vice thing. However, to me at least, Sauron doesn't seem to have the personality. He just seems too serious. When Sauron contemplated capturing Luthien all he seemed to want was the reward for her capture.
Of course, the reward might have been one night free at the "Angband Casino and Brothel" so I guess you never know.

[The Squatter of Amon Rûdh]

So nobody has Sauron down as a collector of cuddly toys, then?

This is probably why we never see the inside of Barad Dur: there's probably a depressing air of professionalism about everything that bores and horrifies at the same time. Perhaps he has an "in" tray; maybe a ledger called the File of Facts, that contains a colour-coded map of Mordor and *all* the ways of skinning a cat; perhaps, I shudder to say it, a board behind his desk bearing a corporate command structure (top-level: The Dark Lord Sauron - proprietor. Next level: Everyone else - vassals).

Truth to tell, Sauron would be pitiable if endowed with less power. His only real source of enjoyment (I doubt he ever has what we'd call "fun") seems to be the suffering of others, especially when brought about by his cunning. I'd say that he's a fan of Saki's Chronicles of Clovis, chess and, perhaps, the Times crossword, were it not for the fact that I don't think any of these things exist in Tolkien's universe (well, definitely not H.H. Munro and The Times at any rate), but he'd like anything that allowed him to wallow in his own cleverness and superiority.
At school we'd have referred to Sauron by the technical term "prat" or words to that effect.

[Kuruharan]

His only real source of enjoyment (I doubt he ever has what we'd call "fun") seems to be the suffering of others, especially when brought about by his cunning.
I don't know if he necessarily even enjoyed that. He might have, but I personally rather suspect that inflicting suffering on others was just another means to an end i.e. dominating everything in sight.
He probably did enjoy wallowing in his own superiority though.

[Pips]

He takes bubble baths.

[Meriadoc]

Maybe he tortured his slaves, that would be fun. As a Dark Lord I would do that all the time, hehe, it's fun

[Aralaithiel]

He probably wrote research papers! LOL!!! smilies/evil.gif
"How to make rings & influence people"
"Making the most of slaves"
"Seven Traits of HIghly Effective Dark Lords"
"Orc/Dark Lord Relations and Exploiting Them to Their Fullest"
Sorry...got carried away!
Seriously...I think he was completely obsessed with finding his ring and getting it back. Definitely no rest for the wicked.

[Maryana]

Like Aralaithiel said, maybe he wrote books or research papers for his relatives (if he had any) or supporters to follow, like:
How To Get Yourself Some Power and What To Do With It When You Have It
The Ring of Power: A Story of a Dark Plan Gone Wrong
People Who Gained Power
The Dark Ages
How To Keep Your Castle Black
1000 Evil Doer's and Their Deals
What To Do When You're a Dark Lord
And etc...hahaha, just kidding.
Though they're pretty good titles, huh? hehe smilies/tongue.gif smilies/biggrin.gif funny stuff. Well...I don't really think he has any off-hours. I mean, he's Dark Lord full of evil emotions for goodness sake. This isn't Hades from Hercules! Though it would be interesting to get them together...as well as Lord Voldemort from the Harry Potter books...hmmm, an interesting trio it would be...ok now I'm babbling nonsense. smilies/rolleyes.gif But it's just kind of funny imagining a Dark Lord wallowing in a bubble-bath...just think about it... smilies/biggrin.gif

[Kuruharan]

For some reason I get the impression that my misery is being mocked. :) And I think that you have that a little backwards. Sauron made his prisoners write research papers.
Hmm...and I was wondering why my professor never physically appears in class, but always appears as this big flaming disembodied eyeball avatar. :eek:

Funny guy, he is always demanding that we give him his Ring back too. Some people are just so strange...

[Aralaithiel]

Sorry Kuruharan! It is just that the subject is a magnet for such silliness! smilies/evil.gif
I had a physics II professor that sounds similar to yours - i.e. the disembodied eyeball avatar. They also do not have office hours!
Celebnoviel - we need to get together for a meeting of the minds! You don't happen to be a Monty Python fan as well, do you?
Great minds think alike! smilies/biggrin.gif Now if I could just get my hubby to truly appreciate my warped humor! smilies/smile.gif

[Kuruharan]

Oh well, my misery needs mocking. (It needs something anyway.)

Actually, the two professors that I'm writing the research papers for aren't so bad.
The guy that reminded me of Sauron, well, I dropped the class in short order. That guy was disturbed. Some of the people in that class were not much better. Weird dudes in black robes who only spoke in high piercing screams (yieessh!) :rolleyes:

[Aralaithiel]

For yor misery Kuruharan, I recommend a nice bottle of single malt scotch smilies/biggrin.gif!!
Or, since you are a college student, a nice whiskey! smilies/cool.gif

[Niphredil Baggins]

I think he watched action movies on palantir-cable. Violence creates violence.

[Meriadoc]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Celebnoviel:
[QB]Like Aralaithiel said, maybe he wrote books or research papers for his relatives (if he had any) or supporters to follow, like:
How To Get Yourself Some Power and What To Do With It When You Have It
The Ring of Power: A Story of a Dark Plan Gone Wrong
People Who Gained Power
The Dark Ages
How To Keep Your Castle Black
1000 Evil Doer's and Their Deals
What To Do When You're a Dark Lord
And etc...hahaha, just kidding.

1001 ways to get the ring
Homemade rings
The power's within the ring
Cooking a Took
"Let's cook" with Dark Lord Sauron
And many many more, he had a great imagination

[Pips]

Originally posted by Kuruharan:
<STRONG>Oh well, my misery needs mocking. (It needs something anyway.)

Actually, the two professors that I'm writing the research papers for aren't so bad.
The guy that reminded me of Sauron, well, I dropped the class in short order. That guy was disturbed. Some of the people in that class were not much better. Weird dudes in black robes who only spoke in high piercing screams (yieessh!) smilies/rolleyes.gif</STRONG>

Wow! Where do you go to school at it? Sounds like my Math professor. ::Shudders:: I'm begining to beleive he's Saruman! Walks around with a long staff and all!

[Kuruharan]

Grr...Math, yuck. I'm glad to say that I have not had a math class in years. No, Dr. Sauron was a Constitutional History/Ethnic History and Studies professor. The reason why I dropped his class was not so much because of his disturbing and morbid weirdness, but rather to prevent myself from doing three research papers in one semester. That's something I would prefer not to have to try. Even though I probably will at some point.

Hmm...looks like Saruman, walks with a long staff...
I'd say that if he speaks to strange round black objects that he has tucked away in his office, and is served by little goblin-like creatures that run around tearing down trees and breeding bigger goblin-like creatures he's probably the guy. :eek:
I'd recommend giving him a new recipe for whipping up a new batch of Uruk-hai. He might give you an A in the class.

[Pips]

Of course he's got little goblin like creatures! I've seen them!

[Pips]

Originally posted by Meriadoc:
<STRONG>[QUOTE]Originally posted by Celebnoviel:
[QB]Like Aralaithiel said, maybe he wrote books or research papers for his relatives (if he had any) or supporters to follow, like:
How To Get Yourself Some Power and What To Do With It When You Have It
The Ring of Power: A Story of a Dark Plan Gone Wrong
People Who Gained Power
The Dark Ages
How To Keep Your Castle Black
1000 Evil Doer's and Their Deals
What To Do When You're a Dark Lord
And etc...hahaha, just kidding.

1001 ways to get the ring
Homemade rings
The power's within the ring
Cooking a Took
"Let's cook" with Dark Lord Sauron
And many many more, he had a great imagination</STRONG>


Revenge on a Ring-Bearer and How to Get it
What to do when you get your Ring of Power back
How NOT to lose your Ring of Power

[Glenethor]

I think he spent hours in therapy, bemoaning how he was misunderstood, that he wasn't 'Evil' but rather had a traumatic childhood. Probably spent years trying to get in touch with his Inner Child, but the Inner Child probably decided to:

Run Away! Run Away!

Who wants to get the play 'Springtime for Sauron off the ground?

smilies/cool.gif

[Aralaithiel]

Actually Glenethor, I think he made numerous appearances on "Jerry Springer"!
I'll gladly help you write that play, Glenethor! smilies/smile.gif Can I put lots of Monty Python elements into it? Pleazzz!!! smilies/biggrin.gif
"Come back here! I'll bite your legs off!"
- The Black Knight to King arthur, MP's Holy Grail

[Scapegoat]

One mention at least is made of what Sauron did for 'fun'.

"And sometimes as a man may cast a dainty to his cat (his cat he calls her, but she owns him not) Sauron would send her prisoners that he had not better uses for: he would have them driven to her hole, and report brought back to him of the play she made."

[The Squatter of Amon Rûdh]

Cirith Ungol: Sauron's Wasp Factory. smilies/wink.gif

[Pips]

Originally posted by Aralaithiel:
<STRONG>Actually Glenethor, I think he made numerous appearances on "Jerry Springer"!
I'll gladly help you write that play, Glenethor! smilies/smile.gif Can I put lots of Monty Python elements into it? Pleazzz!!! smilies/biggrin.gif
"Come back here! I'll bite your legs off!"
- The Black Knight to King arthur, MP's Holy Grail</STRONG>

YEAH! I think I remember seeing him, just the other night! smilies/biggrin.gif

[questor]

Good call scapegoat. There actually is an intellegent responce among all this now.
To Lush, I have to admit, my first instincts about the topic involved a little vice and debauchery. That didn't seem to be the way the forum was headed tho. It's good to know someone else's mind is in the gutter.

[Aralaithiel]

Gutter minds - unite! smilies/evil.gif
That's why I mentioned Jerry Springer!

[Kuruharan]

I said it was a possibility, I just didn't think it was very likely. Give me some credit here. :)

On a serious note, not only does that sort of thing just not seem in character for Sauron personally, it seems out of character in Tolkien's world generally.

I realise that little is known about what the Easterlings and Haradrim were like, but things like that are not described in the books in regards to anybody (except for the vaguest hint in Morgoth that I already mentioned).

[Lush]

I guess to a Sylph like myself, evil and debauchery go hand in hand. I imagine Sauron as a despot with a cold glint in his eyes on the outside, and a bit of the leering, cruel pervert underneath.

[Glenethor]

Seriously? I dunno, because Sauron is more or less left to the imagination in LoTR. Creatures like Sauron (let's say, allegorically, Hitler and Stalin) were notoriously ascetic, although Stalin liked his vodka. The only thing, it seems, that turned their cranks was the exercise of Power over others. Power as ultimate aphrodisiac. But in answer to this serious question, I think he got his jollies driving Saruman and Denethor mad via the Palantir.
========================
Ah! Now we see the violence in the system! Help! Help! I'm being repressed!' smilies/wink.gif

[Aralaithiel]

I agree with you Glenethor, regarding Sauron being left to the imagination. That is why I have a terrible time keeping this topic serious, as my imagination has a mind of it's own. smilies/biggrin.gif
I like what you said too, Lush! smilies/evil.gif

[Pips]

Imagination! Gotta Love it! smilies/biggrin.gif

On a serious note(HA, Like I could ever be serious!) I was just thinking about what Sauron could have looked like. Concerning him from the East. Now I'm not talking about Asia East. But it's possible he could have had the dark skin tones of the Middle East, for it seems to me, that in a lot of Fantasy Novels,(Mostly after Tolkien)Characters from the East took on the Middle East look.

What do you think?

[Bruce MacCulloch]

On a serious note(HA, Like I could ever be serious!) I was just thinking about what Sauron could have looked like. Concerning him from the East. Now I'm not talking about Asia East. But it's possible he could have had the dark skin tones of the Middle East, for it seems to me, that in a lot of Fantasy Novels,(Mostly after Tolkien)Characters from the East took on the Middle East look. Well, I wouldn't say he was from the East. He only lived there. If anything, I would say he was from the West, since he was a Maia. Also, being a Maia and not someone born or created in Arda, his location probably would have had little to do with his physical appearance. This account of his appearance is given in the account of the destruction of Numenor in Akallabeth: But Sauron was not of mortal flesh, and though he was robbed now of that shape in which he had wrought so great an evil, so that he could never again appear fair to the eyes of Men, yet his spirit arose out of the deep and passed as a shadow and a black wind over the sea, and came back to Middle-Earth and to Mordor that was his home. There he took up again his great Ring in Barad-dûr, and dwelt there, dark and silent, until he wrought himself a new guise, an image of malice and hatred made visible; and the Eye of Sauron the Terrible few could endure.
Of the Rings of Power and the Third Age gives almost the same account.

[Elendur]

Just to say my part in this, I dont think Sauron thought of sex at all.

I think he didn't have spare time at all either. There was always something to do for him. With his ring being lost I'm sure he would never rest. It seems like Melkor only took time off to gloat and laugh at those puny elves when he was in full power and felt totally secure. Sauron never felt secure without his ring because he always thought it would be used against him or it would be thrown into the deep seas and he would not see it again for ages.

My 2 cents.

[Glenethor]

Yeah, and he was worried about Isildur's heir. When Aragorn wrests the Palantir from his domination and shows him Anduril, he panics and moves too quickly.

[Manwe]

Well if I were a mighty-evil-crule-dark-lord-that-can't-even-keep-conrtoll-over-my-own-jewelery-and-is-being-defeated-by-three-feet-fat-persons-with-harry-feet, I would acctually shoot myself on the spot. But if I necessary have to do something I'd put a large deal of resources to find out what the **** Tom Bombadil is ... ... Oh! nooo I didn't write that! Ignore this message! ... aarrgghhh!

[ February 14, 2002: Message edited by: Manwe ]

[Glenethor]

I think he was also looking forward to having Pippin over a slow fire.

[The Squatter of Amon Rûdh]

I think he was also looking forward to having Pippin over a slow fire.

Not in the biblical sense, surely? Still, who knows what it was that Morgoth did to corrupt him? ;)

[Glenethor]

Not quite down with your allusion, but Sauron certainly did gloat over Pip in the Palantir and it seemed he was gleeful that one of the Nine would soon drop in on Orthanc and pick poor Pip up and take him back to Mordor.

[Pips]

*Shudders* I'd truly feel sorry for Pippin then. Course, maybe he wanted him for a Court Jester.

[Lush]

Originally posted by Elendur:
<STRONG>Just to say my part in this, I dont think Sauron thought of sex at all.

I think he didn't have spare time at all either. </STRONG>

I believe it was Chiara Mastroianni (the love-child of Catherine Deneuve and Marcello Mastroianni) who said that people who publicly state they "don't have time" for a relationship offer up a pathetic excuse, doubly pathetic when they proclaim to be "too busy" for sex. How do you think Sauron dealt with all that stress of being the Dark Lord? Feeding prisoners to Shelob can only take you so far, particularly since it was Shelob who had most of the fun in the first place. smilies/wink.gif

[Kuruharan]

Sauron...Shelob...
I just had a very disturbing idea for a thread.

[Lush]

Oh no, don't go there! I will have nightmares for weeks!

[Keeper of Dol Guldur]

Back to the Palantir situation, definitely Sauron thought it hilarious that a hobbit was talking to HIM in the palantir. And thought it equally hilarious that Saruman would "torture" him in this way. Very high and mighty, wouldn't you say?

[Lush]

Guess Sauron was laughing too hard to notice the SMALL PROBLEM that was creeping closer and closer to his borders.

[Mat_Heathertoes]

smilies/eek.gif The Eye was rimmed with fire, but was itself glazed, yellow as a cat's, watchful and intent, and the black slit of its pupil open on a pit, a window into nothing.

I believe that Sauron should be forgiven. For all that malice was on account of a badly fitted contact lens ..

[ February 18, 2002: Message edited by: Mat_Heathertoes ]

[Samwise]

I believe that Sauron should be forgiven
smilies/confused.gif Erm...... smilies/confused.gif
I think not.
smilies/eek.gif
"Mr. Frodo, sir!" cried Sam, quaking. "Don't let him hurt me, sir! Don't let him turn me into anything unnatural! My old dad would take on so. I meant no harm, on my honour, sir! "

[Aralaithiel]

Ooohhh...good question about the forgiveness of Sauron. I'll throw my opinion in on this. I read from a pastor here in Tulsa, OK that in order to be forgiven, one has to be TRULY repentent. I do not think that Sauron is in any way remorseful of what he has done, and therefore would not truly repent. Any thoughts?

[Kuruharan]

Truly Repentant=Sorry for what he's done, not just sorry he got caught, right?

Sounds reasonable. :)

Sauron refused pardon at the end of the War of Wrath because he could not put up with the humiliation of being put on trial and (probably) punished. He did see if he could get a pardon though.

[Beren87]

I think that at that last moment, when the ring is destroyed, he truly repented. If their about to die, people tend to truly ask forgiveness, so as not go to hell. smilies/evil.gif

Which in turn means that the main problem in the world is procrastination.

[Kuruharan]

Yeah, but his spirit was refused entry into the West. Remember the whole billowing thunder-cloud being blown away by a cold wind from the West.

[Lush]

Oooh, Manwe giving Sauron the cold shoulder! Niiiiice.

[The Squatter of Amon Rûdh]

all that malice was on account of a badly fitted contact lens..

What a great burden is borne by the makers of optical prosthetics: the fates of so many hang on the millimetric precision of their measurements.

[Pips]

Contact Lenes, my brother has a pair like that.

I don't think Sauron would have repented, I think he was to proud of himself.

[Kuruharan]

Oooh, Manwe giving Sauron the cold shoulder! Niiiiice.

He did the same thing to Saruman too you know.
Maybe it was the similarity of names.

[The Squatter of Amon Rûdh]

He did the same thing to Saruman too you know.
Maybe it was the similarity of names.

You may have something there. Perhaps it was a clerical error: "I'm sorry, Mr. Sauronman, but your application for repatriation has been declined on account of your being the Dark Lord."

[Pips]

Well, you can imagine he was upset

[Lush]

Originally posted by Squatter of Amon Rudh:
<STRONG>

You may have something there. Perhaps it was a clerical error: "I'm sorry, Mr. Sauronman, but your application for repatriation has been declined on account of your being the Dark Lord."</STRONG>

Sauronman: "I demand a re-count!!!"

[Joy]

I really don't think that Sauron had off-hours. I mean, evil never rests.

[Kuruharan]

I really don't think that Sauron had off-hours. I mean, evil never rests.

OH-NO, Somebody's trying to get us back on topic!!! HELP!!! :D

[Joy]

Kind of going back off-topic - To get it back where Kuruharan wants it...

I think that Sauron would never had repented of the evil that he had committed. Pride will not allow a person to repent. Pride goes before the fall as Proverbs states. Pride keeps one believing he/she is right, even after defeat, makes one believe that they have been wronged. Kind of paranoid,in a way, every one is out to get me, I'm the victim here.

[LightningSword]

Is it possible that the evil have rest?
In my opinion, no... But it he did have a lazy hour, prehaps plotting his new plan for .:shivver:. middle-earth domination

[Kuruharan]

Kind of going back off-topic - To get it back where Kuruharan wants it...
Now that you mention it, this thread has had some STRANGE convolutions. And I seem to have been involved in most of them :D .

[Joy]

Welcome LightningSword to the Barrow-Downs. Hope you enjoy your stay here. Post often. Don't worry about us, we're mostly nice, we don't bite.

Don't take some of us seriously. We come here after a long day of something, we just have to vent and be crazy for a while. smilies/biggrin.gif

[Bruce MacCulloch]

Don't worry about us, we're mostly nice, we don't bite. Speak for yourself, rèd. I do bite - but only when asked. smilies/tongue.gif

[The Squatter of Amon Rûdh]

Sauronman: "I demand a re-count!!!"

Absolutely: those cards just weren't punched properly. Must keep things fair.

[Marileangorifurnimaluim]

To drag this back into the gutter - he was into whips and chains, definately. Also I imagine he spent time devising nifty trap doors for those who came with bad news. "My Captain has fallen, has he? Stand where you are." fwip "har-ha-har-har-har."

[The Squatter of Amon Rûdh]

Perhaps with an "excellent" or two thrown in for good measure.
Thinking on the whips and chains aspect, it makes me wonder what disguise it was that got a certain person into Sauron's dungeons. Perhaps it's best not to think of such things; see no evil, hear no evil, speak no evil and so forth.

[Keeper of Dol Guldur]

"Excellent" twiddles his fingers. Oh Mouth, is my teddybear ready.
"Yes sir Mr. Sauron," by the way I love you sir"
Oh great, make my last moments on Middle Earth socially awkward, thank you very much."

Sweet, I could also invision him saying something in answer like..."yes" really dramatically (ala Megatron:Beast Wars) Or having a high pitched, girly voice like so many 80's supervillains.