Amandil is the faithful Númenorean. A M.D. absorbs an followed by the French article il.

Exactly. No danger of the momentum being lost there... ball back in your court O newly criminalised occupant of Amon Rudh....:cool:

Hopefully this one will get you thinking.

In some quarters it's a cheap rock

Three farthing stone?

Yes. That was very quick.

I don'tquite remember pre-decimal currency...
 

Flash of inspiration... and it was a good clue. Hmm try this:

Scion of a noble house, sacred flower sprang up but lost direction.

After despairing to do this with only my memory, and systematically going through the list of rivers on the Encyclopedia of Arda, I finally found one that might make sense.

Flower=river=Ninglor, an Elvish name for the Gladden River

Lost direction=take off N

Ninglor - N = Inglor



Inglor is the name of Gildor's father. In earlier writings that was the name of Finrod, but even ignoring that and looking at just LOTR, Gildor seems to be some important fellow among his bunch, which would suggest that his father was too. And they are both of the House of Finrod, which is quite a noble house indeed...

Where sacred comes in, though, no clue have I.

Can't fault the logic and full marks for ingenuity but it isn't Inglor. the first bit is the "straight" clue. If it helps the river isn't in Middle Earth and sacred relates to it. the rest of the clue will give you the rest of the name.

I thought this was easy ... :confused:

Apparently not...

Don't think I've abandoned this thread. I've been thinking about it a lot, and I can't really make the river fit with the rest of the clue. I'm still working on it. :)

Sprang up but lost direction could be replacedby bloomer loses direction if it helps...

Oy... Rivers, bloomers, physics homework one on top of the other... My head is amess. :p

Is it Mallor?

Mallos - S (south) + R (river)?

I don't know. I have to think some more.

Only the solution is a middle earth thing. Remember that the alternate clues give the same answer. I thiny you may be trying too hard since I don't know who Mallor is (bad Tolkienista).

The second part of the clue is rose - e. So we have the scion of a noble house whose name ends in ros. There are three possible answers and I can't work out how to achieve any of them from 'sacred flower'. I think it's Maedhros, but the only reference I can find to maedh being sacred is in the name of St Maedhog, Bishop of Ferns.

Yes it is -ros but not that one and the first bit is really straightforward. At least to me...

and seemingly there are even more things I don't now about than I ever imagined... Bishop of Ferns..who'd a thunk it?

Ah. As usual, I have been looking for precisely the wrong things in exactly the wrong places.

I'm fairly certain I know the -ros guy, but I won't steal it from Squatter who has really done all the work.

I had no clue who he was either. I was guessing-and-checking various letter combinations that could be formed from ME flowers, and I got that. Apparently he's a king of Arthedain.

Elros seems like the most likely candidate then, but that answer makes no sense.

I can't see why. It isn't. Had been Elros I would have had something about the Spanish in there... Galadriel you have done your share too...

Will one of you please put this poor clue and its writer out of its misery?

Is it Saeros? I'm running out of scions here.

Knickers on head pencils up nose *wibble*

If I say sacred flower of verse does it help?

*beats self over the head for excessive unhelpfulness*
 

Things that just fit by dumb hammering down (with the blows mostly landing on fingers):

Poros - Po is a river=flower in Italy, or could be a pun on Poe.

...Which is my best - and only - guess so far.

Things that might fit with some craftier and more diligent hammering:

Cair Andros
Celebros
Rauros
Aros
Ladros


There are no more "-ros"es, scions or no. I'm totally lost.


Aros makes very little sense cryptic-wise, so I think I can eliminate that one. Ladros and Celebros don't seem impossible to hammer to the right shape. Rauros and Cair Andros are a bit oddly-shaped if you take the -ros away.

Nothing makes sense straight-clue-wise.

I promise to think more about it this evening. :Merisu:


EDIT: I just found out that there is a Rau River in Tanzania. So Rauros also fits with the same logic as Poros, but both look equally ridiculous from the straight clue perspective.

EDIT2: I was thinking before that it's Elros because of this meaning of "el". I thought it somehow refers to "sacred". Well, I was wrong.

No. None of those. It is a person. The sacred river is mainly literary as indicated by the "of verse" that I added. BUT not aME river as previously established. It does come from what I fondly but clearly wrongly imagined was one of the most famous poems in the English language (it is a "standard clue" which I borrowed being lazy!!!).

The person only appears in HoME maybe UT though the house and person of which he is a scion is rather better known. No hammeering is required.

Would the answer then be Alphros? I don't remember ever encountering that name in my readings, but looking up river poetry lead me to a sacred river Alph...

In Xanadu did Kubla Khan a stately pleasure dome decree...
 

Hurrah. Alphros, 24th Prince of Dol Amroth and grandson of Imrahil.

wanders off muttering about the man from Porlock and what they clearly aren't teaching in schools anymore....

And on her dulcimer she played, singing of Mount Abora
 

I considered Alph but hadn't heard of Alphros. There's nothing wrong with my Coleridge; it's my HME that's rusty.

For he on honey-dew hath fed,
 

And drunk the milk of Paradise.

Well that is reassuring... ;)

Just shows that obscure and obvious is a very individual thing....

In my school they barely teach poetry. And most of the poems we are taught sound like "Red. Cake. Book cover. Glue stick. Headache. Elephant." and we are supposed to decipher "the author's message". :( Perhaps I am just under the wrong education system on the wrong side of the Great Pool.

I am glad to have learned of the Kubla Khan poem, though. I think I might even try to convince my teacher to assign it instead of another gibberish one.


Anyways, I think your clue was a good one, and it was certainly interesting to solve. Squatter and I dug up things we would probably never have encountered otherwise! :D This is certainly one of the more educating quizzes around...

So enough ranting, and for my clue:


Fortress of metal messed up before second person takes position of note in aged man

I thought this one would take up a few hours max... :confused: Should I give a hint?

I am not ignoring it..just don't have anything I am confident of trying yet..

Would this help?
 

Don't go looking for a man. That's not the straight road......erm, clue. :D




(For clarity's sake: Aman and the straight road are just jokes, not hints. But the answer is not a man.)

Still no luck?

Fortress is the straight clue. Fortress, fastness, stronghold, what have you.

Before separates the two parts that the clue is made up of. When you solve them and put them together you'll get the answer.

Aged man is not a reference to a specific person/character. Find a synonym for it.

Ok right well that helps.... I had got fortress of metal in my head as a straight clue which led me to think of Angband and Thangorodrim which didn't work at all.... so looking for a metallic anagram toonpresuambly with messed up...


Gondolin doesn't work that I can see save having gold in it.. seems I need to mug up my fortresses..

You're right, Gondolin doesn't work. But it's partially on the right track...

Dol Guldur? Gold anagram. The old man is an elder and if you sub in U (you 2nd person) for E (a note) you get uldur?

That is completely...





....






...






....







...





...Correct!!! :D Dol Guldur is the place. Ask us!

Well I needed the spoonfeeding there this should be easy..though my judgement on such matters is off!!

Restorer in France upsets a tray after French wine.

En=in, in French
vin=wine, in French
yatar=a scramble of a tray

The whole being Envinyatar, which means "Renewer".

Exactement ma petite. Back to you...:D