You just don't seem like Wolf-Sally.

Are you a wolf?

I seriously doubt that, because he's made it harder for himself to win as well The only real motive he could have had for that is revenge, twisted though it is.

Since examining the comments and interactions of the known (and all but known) wolves is our best option at the moment, I remembered this from I think, yesterDay.

Obviously there's at least one packmate in her "looks good" list, very possibly two, but probably not all three of them. That would be a bit risky, even though Wilwa hadn't been under any major suspicion up to that time. Rikae is a wolf, leaving Kath, Nerwen and Lalaith. What she says about Kath could be noteworthy. More on that in a moment.

If there's a wolf here, the likelihood is that it's Nienna. I'm not convinced of it, but she looks worse than the other two. I feel pretty good about Mira, and really don't know about Shasta. I keep forgetting about him.

I cut off her remarks on Steve, but they obviously don't matter. Hard to tell anything from that, except that she casts a bit of suspicion on Folwren with a specific point, which may make Foley look less likely as a mate. Or not.

The post from Kath that induced Wilwa to put her at the top of the trust list was this one:

Nog quickly questioned Wilwa's trust for Kath based on that post.

This was Wilwa's response.

I was focused on Tum yesterDay, I admit, so I just took note of this mentally and moved on. Now that Wilwa's known to be a wolf, this ought to be examined.
Was Kath's effort worthy of her going into Wilwa's most trusted ranks? It does seem to stick out, in that Wilwa looks to have been waiting for a reason to praise Kath, who had been about as submarine-like as one could be.
Kath if I'm not mistaken though, is looking at a modfire toDay if she doesn't vote. And if she's a wolf, she's been extremely uninvolved with helping her mates.

x/d with a couple of Niennas and Sallys.

Are you kidding Inzil? I missed yesterDay due to busyness and ... ahem ... drunkenness. :p But I caught up on yesterDay and I know the rules - I'm not about to cause the player list to drop any further after toDay's happenings with a Shirriff AND our true Seer gone. The latter of which by the way ... what?! What was that about? We clearly have a maniacal Zeus or one who has decided they're not on the side of the village.

Plus my vote is obvious in light of Tum being proven right about Nog.

++RIKAE

I do need to read over things in more depth, but I'm around for the next three hours to do that - I just wanted to vote now so as to avoid any possible modfiring!

As my last sentence indicated, I didn't conclude that you must be a wolf. As a matter of fact, looking over things myself the last half hour or so has given me another possibility about you.

I can't keep up this not doing lists thing so I apologise but that is what is coming in the next couple of posts as it will help me work out where we are right now. And hey it might be useful to some others too!

Known roles:
Blind Guardian - Aphrodite so Lover.
Boro - Hermes and false Seer (by default).
Eonwe - mortal.
Tum - Apollo and true Seer.
Nog - Poseidon.
Lottie - Artemis so Hunter.
wilwa - Hera so wolf and Lover.
Mac - Hercules so Shirriff.
Rikae - Ares so wolf (by Tum's dream).

Which means we have left:
Zeus - who is apparently not on the side of the village. Had the choice to kill, protect, see the role of a player or have an extra vote. Chose to kill the true Seer. Now powerless - should be an innocent from now ... apparently not.
Hestia - mythomaniac who is either true or false Seer.
Hades - wolf and Lover.
Persephone - Lover.
Demeter - protector of Persephone.
Hebe - only remaining Shirriff and so now just an innocent.
Hephaestus - wolf.
Pan - ranger.
Dionysus - cursed ... who as far as we know has not been turned?
Eros - Hunting Guardian.
Athena - Goddess of Wisdom.

Soooo, those who are actually evil and intending to harm the village:
Hades
Hephaestus
Persephone (possibly)

Those who potentially may be harmful to the village:
Zeus ... apparently.
Demeter
Dionysus - as they know they're the cursed they could choose to be on the wolves side.

Those who are definitely on the side of good:
Hestia - by now they must know if they're the true or false Seer and either way they're on the side of the village.
Hebe
Pan
Eros
Athena

Unknown roles:
Mira
Inzil
Nienna
Nerwen
Folwren
Lalaith
Greenie
Shasta
phantom
sally
Kath - putting myself in so this list tallies with the number of roles.

So, looking at those unknowns next.

Foley:
24 – Lottie talks a lot, Nerwen seems sensible, Wilwa seems all right
30 – Doesn’t want to lynch Phantom; thinks Rikae’s idea of lynching the seer sounds dangerous
84 – Hunch that Kath and Nog are NOT among the lovers but if they are then they aren’t innocent lovers (for discussing the role)
96 – Votes Steve for trying but not succeeding at being natural

Day 2
420 – Doesn’t think we should kill Nog or Phantom

Day 3
756 – Thinks Nog and Nerwen (and their interaction) is suspicious but Nerwen more so than Nog (for gut feelings); thinks Tum looks suspicious; thinks Phantom still innocent; opinion of Sally uncertain; Mac’s distrust of Zil and Wilwa stands out.
834 – Can’t bring her self to vote Nog because she doesn’t mistrust him. Votes Lottie instead.
841 – Talks about possible nightly PMs. This post is the strongest that makes me think she’s not a wolf. I don’t know if a wolf would be daring enough to talk about possible PMs openly on the thread

Day 4
872 – Isn’t sure why people are sure Nerwen’s not a wolf I’m wondering the exact same thing… I’m actually becoming rather suspicious of Nerwen just from reading other people’s posts including Wilwa’s and Rikae’s; wishes Greenie weren’t gone so she could explain her suspicion of Mac

Conclusions: I’m thinking that she is probably not a wolf. Her posts and ideas regarding roles and wolves just don’t seem like stuff a wolf would say. This isn’t to say she’s not a very sneaky wolf but I don’t think so.

List:

Inoocent:
Nienna

Leaning Innocent:
Foley
Sally
Mira
Kath

Unsure:
Zil
Lal
Greenie
Shasta
Phantom

Leaning Wolf:
Nerwen

Wolf:
Rikae

Right, couple of disclaimers. This takes hours. And with Day 1 being 8 pages (!!!) I'm not going to have time to do more than that. Now, you might say, why not look at later Days. Well, because I think that on Day 1 people are slightly less cautious - feeling more able to hide in early banter. By Day 3 with some roles revealed by kill/lynch and just generally fewer people hiding is not so easy. Also, we know the lynch toDay, so I have toMorrow to continue this. (Listens for groans of despair at that statement!)

Mira - thinks the hints being talked about were probably not serious. Repeats that Boro couldn't be Lover-hinting if Zeus. Refused to vote for possible hinters given what she said earlier - fair enough. Boro and Eonwe turned out to be innocent though, so this could be good cover for Nerwen if she and Mira are both wolves.

Inzil - "Singling out possible gifteds? You're clearly a wolf." To Rikae. Probably joking but possibly not if also a wolf. Supported Nog on suspecting Eonwe. Says Boro doesn't sit right, suspects Mac just because, and wants to vote BG for no substance. Pretty much going with the top talkers/suspects of the Day. The BG vote was the same lines as mine, I just wonder about it because Inzil seemed to have more reasoning for a Mac vote.

Nienna - ignores phantom, praises wilwa (for what?). Says Eonwe 'slipping' bears watching. Votes for Eonwe in case he's the Cursed. Well it's consistent.

Nerwen - please, tell me for my sanity, are you typo-ing Folwren every time deliberately? Hmm, and about Zeus says: "Well, I'd hope so, but some people will have it that a surviving Lover has automatically lost anyway" - so could be someone who if Zeus would want the village to lose. Defending herself against Mac using 'he only suspected me after I suspected him'. Didn't think Eonwe was the Cursed. Voted Nog as wasn't happy with the BG/Eonwe bandwagons.

Folwren - Day 1 felt bad about Lottie, thinks Nerwen sensible and wilwa seems alright. Defends phantom and suspects Rikae. Not sure Foley would mention packmates at all ... which makes me think fairly well of Nerwen. Voted Eonwe as he seemed to be trying to hard to be innocent.

Lalaith - under the radar to me. But: "many seem to have taken too freely of Ganymede's cups" - Dionysus hint? And: "particularly as Zeus himself is not whole-heartedly allied to the village" - our odd Zeus? Voted Boro because the vote 'could throw up something useful'. Need to check if that was ever explained - as in, did it?

Greenie - said wouldn't vote wilwa or Foley Day 1 and thought Nerwen innocentish. If Greenie were a wolf this would make me think Foley and Nerwen probably weren't. List post, only suspicions were of Mac, voted him. Clearly proven wrong now ... but then Gifteds often get confused for wolves.

Shasta - thinks Nerwen and Nog both innocent, Boro wasn't hinting, and votes Eonwe in case he's the Cursed. By the way what was the bolding on 'light of my life' about?

phantom - may not be our odd Zeus given his comment to Boro about not feeling too free about where to place loyalties. Also as when talking about lynching the Seer he says: "Quite right, it will keep him from leading us astray with his false dreams later on. Good idea!" And as he was talking with Boro about his Seer hints I'm fairly sure this means he thought Boro the false Seer. Not sure he'd be so blase about offing the true one. Plus he says: "If Hera dies, then isn't he at that point on the side of the village." Thinks Mac and Nerwen innocent. Also doesn't agree that Eonwe is Dionysus.

sally - hints toward maybe being an ordo. So you know what I hate? A post with 3 paragraphs about not being able to post properly and an edit ... that then contains an unexplained vote. Just saying. Anyway, votes BG without explanation - did we get one later?

Ok, posting this now. Thoughts in addition to those I've noted as I've gone to follow.

This is for my own convenience, because I'm OCD about having lists of stuff so I can remember what's going on.

The Known
Wilwa (Hera, lover wolf)
Boro (Hermes, false seer)
BG (Aphrodite, wolf lover)
Lottie (Artemis, hunter)
Steve (mortal)
Tum (Apollo, true seer)
Rikae (Ares, wolf)
Mac (Hercules, shirriff)
Nog (Poseidon, unicorn)


Therefore, unknown players....
Kath
Mira
Zil
Nienna
Nerwen
Folwren
Lalaith
Greenie
Shasta
Phantom
Sally (to the rest of you anyway)

And unassigned/unfound roles....
Zeus (lover wolf)
Hestia (seer, but which?)
Hades (lover wolf
Persephone (wolf lover)
Demeter (special knowledge ordo)
Hebe (shirriff, now ordo since Mac’s gone)
Hephaestus (lover wolf, now wolf since BG’s dead)
Pan (ranger)
Dionysus (cursed, so far unturned)
Eros (ranger/hunter combination)
Athena (special knowledge ordo)


Back in a second with lists of guilt/innocence.

Guilty, period
Rikae

Leaning guilty
Foley (for both her talking freely of possible gifteds and just plain weirdness, among other things)

Feeling icky about them
Mira
Nerwen (?)
Nienna (she's being too nice to me maybe?)

No idea
Kath
Shasta

Leaning innocent
Greenie
Phantom (although a possible Zeus)
Lal
Dun

Brilliant and safe
Sally

Ok, final thoughts.

Mira - I don't really know. If Nerwen's a wolf I think Mira more likely to be, but then she's most likely too good a player to leave such obvious trails. Not sure.

Inzil - just wondering about the choice of BG over Mac. If that's explained well then I'm leaning innocent.

Nienna - was consistent but not so much involved. Not sure.

Nerwen - don't know. Avoiding the BG/Nog thing completely can equally be a sign of a confused innocent or an avoiding wolf. Nerwen I kind of doubt would be an avoiding wolf. I don't doubt she'd be a wolf masquerading as a confused innocent. Not sure about her. Would like to know her role as I find others dependent on it. But that's not a good enough reason for a lynch really.

Folwren - feels innocent. Could be tricksy and false. If a wolf then I think Nerwen innocent. Not sure.

Lalaith - somehow avoided all the hint talk that surrounded Boro/Nerwen/Eonwe. Interesting. A wolf with packmates avoiding it? Or had everyone decided hints meant nothing by now?

Greenie - could have been a wolf going after a beleaguered Mac. Could have been an innocent misunderstanding a Gifted way of playing. Not sure.

Shasta - nothing to go on there.

phantom - well I don't think he's Zeus. Not sure if he's a wolf.

sally - again another who got away with hints. Well, not so much hints as kind of announcing she has some kind of innocent role.

So:
I'd be interested to find out Nerwen's role because I think it will give out quite a lot of information. Lalaith I think could be wolvish. sally could easily be bluffing. Deeper looks at these three tomorrow.

And now to bed.

Oh and sally? Did your roles list about two posts further up. :p

Busy, and about to walk out the door for a bit, but I thought I'd address this. As I said (once or twice ;)) Mac and I seem to have a history of suspecting one another from the start of every game. Because of that, I've become hesitant of voting for him early without more to go on.

Nah, I kept reading her name that way. I only just realised the proper spelling. Sorry, Foley.

Now I just want to correct a couple of things you've said here:
No. People– starting with Rikae, I might add– have been reading evil plots into the fact that I said this– but at the time, the rules about the Lovers hadn't been clarified– that was the point of the discussion. I was worried that if Hera died, and Zeus had no way to win, he'd take it out on the village. (Which he did anyway, for some reason– and no, I wouldn't have done that, if it was me. I like winning.)

No– because he didn't start suspecting me until other people went after him because he'd said I could be Hades, then did nothing about it. Do you see the difference?

But everyone has a role in this game, Kath.

Er... you call what he did "potential"?

She said she though I had some kind of innocent role, not just a role in general.

Potentially (and in fact definitely) harmful, yes.


Nerwen, have you taken to not understanding/twisting words?

Okay then, it may end up that I don't participate at all in the debate today. I'm RL socializing with Tum and Sally (no we're not discussing Werewolf Devin!), plus it's obvious who we're lynching today. If I'm still around tomorrow I'll try and do some good reading and extensive commentary and accusing etc.

And since everyone voting the same way is boring...

++ Sally :p

*cough cough* Sally you are avoiding my question.

No, have you?:rolleyes: She said you "got away with hints" because you suggested you were an innocent gifted.

I was pointing out that that's not fair. It illustrates what I don't like about Kath's approach: she basically wasn't playing the first few Days, and now she's analysing early posts by just skimming and guessing at the context. Yes, I accept that it takes too long to read the whole thing, but I've just got to question how useful it is at all.

As a more general thing, I just don't like it– who does?– when submarine players finally surface late in the game, and then trade on how "clean" they've managed to keep themselves. And we've got a whole fleet of subs in this game (though what subs are doing on Mt Olympus is another matter).

EDIT:X'd with Nienna.

It's fun to see you squirm, m'dear. :p

Okay, got it now. Sorry, I thought you were questioning her wording on my innocent role hints rather than just role hints. Misunderstood. *blushes*

Fine then, it's very easy to move you to the top of my suspects list. You are now acting like Wolf-Sally. Not good, my dear, not good. It also doesn't help that Tum suspected you heavily and you had an interesting interaction with Rikae yesterDay.

Whatever makes you happy. It's not like I can say who I am anyway.

:Merisu:

Goodness, is there no power in subtlety anymore? ;)

I didn't ask you who you were... just if you were a wolf :p

I've already said numerous times that I was an innocent.

Now I feel like I'm out of the loop. Okay, Nienna, I presume there's some reason why you think asking Sally if she's a wolf will get results. Care to share it with the class?

She's just trying to be tricksy, that's all.

But... but... :confused:

I was wondering how she would respond. Some people would joke, others become nervous, etc. I believe I've gotten what I was looking for.

Thank you, phantom. Isn't he great, ladies? Now Mr. phantom, if you'll just go with these nice men...:rolleyes:

If you say so.

To recap the voting for Day 4 thus far (not that it's difficult):

Greenie--> Rikae
Lalaith--> Rikae
Inzil--> Rikae
Nerwen--> Rikae
Shasta--> Rikae
Nienna--> Rikae
Kath--> Rikae
tp--> Sally

Hasn't voted: Sally, Folwren, Mira

And I got what I was looking for. Isn't sharing a beautiful thing? :Merisu:

Mmmhm as long as you all stay away from a particular Formy :D

Bahahahaha!

No time to read a word. Just wanted to get here and vote -

++Rikae

Ridiculous amount of family drama going on. No time to comment, but sort of read.

++Rikae

Has anyone posted a complete voting break-down (every single day in one post)? That would be super.

And I see old Mac is dead. See? I was right about him too. Hey, I realize I'm not setting the world on fire this game, but I have at least correctly called BG, Steve, Lottie, and Mac. That earns me some points, right?

I don't like Folwren as much any more. I thought it was possible that she was a Seer actually because of some things she said Day 1 and 2, and now I wonder if she was paving for a false reveal.

And Meeper- I still think she's insane, but probably innocent.

Kath- she looks pretty good. Nothing to do with being a Wolf, of course, but just thought I'd mention it.
No, it wasn't. And no, it wouldn't have. You're deluded.

And your mother is a hamster.

Voting tally for all three Days.

Known roles at time of posting:
Blind Guardian: Aphrodite (Lover). Boro: Hermes (False Seer). Eonwe: Ordo. Nogrod: Poseidon (Unicorn). Lottie: Artemis (Hunter). Wilwa: Hera (Wolf). Mac: Hercules (Shirriff). tum: Apollo (true Seer). Rikae: Ares (Wolf).


Day One votes

Folwren --> Eonwe
Greenie --> Mac
Kath --> Blind Guardian
Lalaith --> Boromir
Zil --> BG 2
Nienna --> Eonwe 2
Sally --> BG 3
Nog --> Nerwen
Wilwa --> BG 4
Mira --> BG 5
Rikae --> the phantom
Mac --> Nerwen 2
Blind Guardian --> Zil
Shasta --> Eonwe 3
Lottie --> Eonwe 4
Tum --> BG 6
Boro --> Eonwe 5
Eonwe --> BG 7
Nerwen --> Nogrod

Didn't vote: the phantom.


Day Two votes

Greenie --> Mac
Shasta --> Nog
Kath --> Nog (2)
Lalaith --> Eonwe
Nog --> Eonwe (2)
Wilwa --> Eonwe (3)
Nienna --> Eonwe (4)
Inzil --> Eonwe (5)
Rikae --> Rikae
Loslote --> Nog (3)
autume --> Nog (4)
the phantom --> Eonwe (6)
Mac --> Eonwe (7)
Eonwe --> Nog (5)
Nerwen --> Eonwe (8)

Didn't vote: Wilwa, Mira, Folwren, Sally.


Day Three votes

Nog --> Lottie
Greenie --> Nog
Lal --> Lottie
Zil --> Tum
Wilwa --> Tum
Mira --> Phantom
Mac --> Lottie (3)
Rikae --> Tum
Nienna --> Tum (4)
Tum --> Rikae
Sally --> Nog (2)
Lottie --> Nog (3)
the phantom --> Nog (4)
Folwren --> Lottie (4)
Nerwen --> Nog (5)

Didn't vote: Kath, Shasta.