I should vote soon-ish and I feel like voting sally, but something keeps me from just doing it... Oh well...

Tadaaa!

I am back after some fun hours playing association football (just to avoid confusion)

I have already looked over the posts that have been made since I left and I thought I spottet a thing or two that I found interesting, I will report back to you about that soon.

Right, it's bedtime for me so I must vote. I never did manage to go back over everyone with a clear mind, every time I tried I just kept finding that they weren't suspicious at all because in the back of my mind I always had this idea that Gwath was suspicious. Therefore I must vote for the one I find suspicious and that is:

++GWATH

Okay. My paper's done and I just got back from Lincoln, where I got my picture taken about 150 times. Sally's not a pretty girl. Sally doesn't like pictures. But Sally's a theater minor and they're required, so Sally had to go.


Oh wait. This isn't my blog! :rolleyes:


Anyway, I'm back and still a tad cranky. Seems that I may be in for a lynching. If so, have at it. Seems every time I'm an innocent I try to help and end up dead. I'm all for tradition, so enjoy yourselves. (Told you. Cranky.)


Moving on. :) I'll go redo my analysis of Nerwen (so she'll see it all in one post and be happy again) and I'll see what else I can get done. If I do end up dying, I may as well make myself useful to the village, yeah? Because apparently making sure we don't have a non-existent player around on the last Day isn't being helpful. But never fear! I shall try to assist.


And then take a nap. Because I'd like to sleep at some point. ;)

[/crabbiness]


ETA: No, I'm not crabby because of the game, by the way. Just so no one here thinks I'm mad at them. I'm just terribly sleep-deprived and such business.

I might have spoken too soon when I said I spotted something interesting, when I re-read it, it became quite ordinary.

This was what I thought as well, I think Gil would be nice to have around as he is no thread and he will take up some of our focus. (unless of course that we just decide that he is innocent and never talk about him again)

A thread in numbers?
Gil does not count for anymore than the rest of us does he?

Can you really advocate any lynch without looking very suspicious?
Maybe you can, but it is very difficult.

At first I thought this conversation reflected bad on Lommy, but after looking at it again it does not seem overly suspicious. I did find Lommy's thoughts a bit odd, but that does not need to mean anything and Phantom put things straight in the end anyways.

EDIT: Cross posted with Sally

No, but it's a question like "do we lynch one innocent more or not"?

Yes. Some lynch-advocations look less suspicius to some others.

And sally m'dear, you're making my life difficult. Whenever someone says they're innocent I want to trust them. But on the other hand, no one else striks me as as suspicious as you do... Hmmm.

Btw, we've all been semi-lazy (except Brinn) and rather quiet toDay. Let's be a bit more productive toMorrow, shall we? :)

I have tried to do my bit, but I am not a floodposter. . .I only keep posting if others do as well, otherwise I feel like I am talking to my self.

++sally

If you're indeed innocent, then I'm sorry for making your day even worse. :) But if you're a wolf, I'm not so sorry. :Merisu:

I assume tp will post us something more comprehensive before today ends. Or at least I hope he will.

I'm going now. See you toMorrow.


edit: xed with Rune

Here's a start. See, that's the thing that tipped me off to Nerwen in the first place, and I did indeed mention it. That and her comment right after Cabbie was killed. Notice that I came up with the thought, not Morm, as Nerwen suggested (which if I remember right is the biggest piece of her case against me besides the double lynch day). In fact, Morm actually disagreed with my reasoning above. Granted, he could have been bluffing to distance himself from me, but it seemed pretty genuine for Morm so I'll take it at face value, at least as much as I'd trust a wolf.



My sincerest apologies, but I keep falling asleep going through posts. I'm off to take a small nap. I'll be back as soon as I can, I promise. Sorry again for being so bloody useless all game. Heh. *toddles off for a bit*

Okay: I see Sally has acquired a couple of votes.

While she's the person I am currently most likely to vote for, I'd like to hear more from her first.

I wanted to wait around to see Sally's case against Nerwen, but it is late now and I am totaly destroyed from playing football.

I actually find the begining rather interesting, I would have liked to be around to see where she is going with it and to have debated a bit more.

Gwath, just because you defended a wolf when she already had been sentenced to lynching does not necessarily mean you are innocent. For all we know, it could've been some sort of bluff.

Can I just clarify something? The reason I didn't like Sally's "flaw in the plan" business, and her push for a triple-lynch, is not that I'm so opposed to lynching Gil, but because it looks to me like she might have been seeking a way to "accidentally" de-rail the double-lynch. A risky business, certainly, but I wouldn't be surprised at a wolf panicking at that situation.

Re: Sally's post at #1609.

Ah... now this is a start, Sally. Not much of a start, but a start. In your own post that you quoted above, you say that it's "irrelevant" who my packmates were in that game. Not so: one of them was Nogrod, and the idea to kill you came from him.

Yes, you came up with a weak reason to suspect someone already suspected on equally weak grounds– which completely contradicted yours, by the way. (In contrast, quite a number of people thought the kill pointed to Nogrod... but no-one was willing to base a case against him on that alone.)

:rolleyes:morm disagreed because his "theory" of why I was a wolf depended on my knowing perfectly well there was a Ranger... and lying about it. Have you actually not realised that yet?

However, the fact that you haven't is a point in your favour, as you'd think mormewolf would have told you at Night. Hmmn.

But anyway, Sally, I asked for your current case... the one which has to take into account the heavy attack on me from a known wolf. I'm not trying to trap you: I want to give you a chance to explain yourself. You're going to have to do better than you have so far.

I'm torn at the moment. It seems to me that your behaviour towards me could mean one of two things:

1. You're a wolf. You made a "me-too" leap for me when morm attacked me, without noticing that your reasoning contradicted his. You continued "suspecting" me after morm was exposed, without coming up with an explanation, because you weren't thinking like an innocent.

2. You're an ordo. You haven't had time to pay much attention to the game, and you're suspecting me out of habit and stubbornness.

General comment: the reason I'm findiing it so hard to make up my mind is that I've played a game in which the following things happened:

1. Rikae (wolf) and I (ordo) fought bitterly for a couple of Days.
2. Rikae was exposed by the Seer.
3. Sally pushed very hard to have me lynched instead of the known wolf Rikae, because she was "so stinking sure" I was a wolf too.
4. Sally got lynched next Day for her blatant attempt to save Rikae.
5. Sally turned out to be an ordo.

I have to go out now– I hope to be back in an hour or so.

EDIT: X'd with Rune and Brinniel.

In the meantime, please look at my last post.

I really don't know what to think.

The internet was down in the lab at work, so yeah... haven't been able to read or do anything at all.

On a purely instinctual level I would like to lynch Gwath and Rune, leaving me as the only male in the entire community. But I don't think those instincts have anything to do with Werewolf.

As I said, I'm not sure if I'm thinking correctly on Sally due to meeting her in RL, because in RL, even though I was trying not to talk about the game or read her, she seemed rather innocent. But then maybe I'm wrong because I was actively trying to sabotage my readings on her. Anyway, were I a Rep I wouldn't have the guts to lynch her.

I admit that events have put Gwath into a rather suspicious position, so I can hardly object to lynching him.

I need to read over Rune. I have no leanings on him currently.

Lommy is being ususually nice to me. So naturally I'm won over and think she should live forever.

Now I'm going to try and read a little.

At this point I'm just going to ignore Nerwen (not entirely, but I'm no longer going to respond to her egging me on, which is essentially all it is now) because I don't want to spend my potentially last hour alive in the village on her. So on that note I say one more time.

I suspect you of my own accord. No one else swayed me either way. I suspect you because you behaved suspiciously and I know that you, being crafty, would be pulling some of the same moves the wolves were pulling earlier in the game, and the way you react to my suspicion of you (rather rudely, might I add because you're suspecting me on much less, which I'll get to in a minute, yet you say it is I that is stubborn) makes me all the more suspicious.

And your case on me relies on such silly things.
A: I followed Morm in his suspicion of you. False. I suspected you as soon as I saw your post (the one about how 'expected' Cabbie's death was or whatever it was) because it seemed to awkward. I thought your lack of knowledge of the rules (particularly the ranger slip, though I do admit that could have been innocent I think it's very possible it was not) seemed off. You don't strike me as the kind to not pay attention to these things, so the fact that you made that mistake either means you are innocent and forgot to check everything or that you are a wolf and had assumed there was a ranger. Which would have factored into who you wanted to kill (granted Nog and Morm and Ka would have known, but most likely assumed you did as well) that fateful night. In short, I've covered why I suspected you, or at least why I started to suspect you, and that is the end of the discussion. Obviously there are others but there are other people in the game to concentrate on too.

B: the double/triple lynch day. Mind, I voiced my unhappiness with Nerwen being a rep because I suspected her. So yes, I was more than happy to go to the lengths to make sure the plan worked. (And admittedly I was a little overeager, but that's because I actually had a day off and was pretty much just hyperactive because I had the opportunity to be so in some context). I didnt' expect you to take action that Day, but when Morm's vote for Phantom made you the other voting rep, I got even more worried than I already was. And am I to be suspected for trying to help the village? I realized there was an alternative way to vote and put it up for discussion. Essentially I wanted to give Phantom the opportunity to kill Nog (and myself, just to spite the silly man ;)) and figured that if I had the chance, the addition to the plan wasn't that complicated. Never did I not run my idea past the group first, nor did I act against the will of the group on that Day. I simply provided alternatives to the idea we (or rather, Boro) already had.

C: You just always suspect me. Fair enough. I'm a bit biased myself, because in the last game in which you were a wolf you were, indeed, fairly crafty, and so I've learned never to trust you in the game unless I know your role. However, I have not continued to suspect you without cause and I haven't been simply concentrating on you (or at least I'd like not to be, but alas it appears I am spending my potential last hours talking about you) so I don't see how that is a problem. I don't have you on an auto-suspect list; I just refuse to trust you. There's a difference. Oh, and in that game you mentioned? Note that I was innocent. Scatterbrained and innocent, so basically you're saying that I act suspicious when I'm not so the fact that I'm suspicious means....I must be? Hehe. Does not compute.



Sorry. Forgot to turn on my alarm, apparently. Here now, and I'll go through and respond to a few things. Just give me a few minutes to collect my brain because otherwise you'll end up with more posts as all over the place as this one. My thoughts on Nerwen are in the open. I'll answer any questions anyone has, but I'm done spending my time on one person. I still need to rethink Ilya and Gwath. (And that Phantom's not half as funny as he appears, children, so watch that one:smokin:)

Sally, you have either not read my post properly, not understood it, or you are twisting it on purpose.

You have covered why you started to suspect me. So why did you continue? That's the question I have asked you repeatedly, and which you have ignored.

I also do not like your strawman tactic of claiming that one of my points is that I always suspect you. This is simply not true, on either count.

Please, Sally, I know you're pressed for time, but if you have a better defence I want to hear it. I don't want to lynch you if you're innocent.

Sounds similar to lupine alpha-male behavior - which, of course, ultimately just comes down to breeding rights. I'd say you've played too much Werewolf and it has worked its way into your basest instincts.

I've answered that. It's because of the way you reacted (and continue to react) to my suspicion of you.


And you said it yourself. I didn't mean to imply that you always suspect me, but that I'm pretty sure you would have suspected me no matter how I behaved the last couple days. Sorry for not making that more clear.


Off to Ilya. Hopefully. (I think I need to do some tinkering on my computer real quick because he's acting funny, eating things he shouldn't and such, so I'll be back ASAP.)

Sally, I ignored your initial suspicion of me. At that time I was having too much trouble defending myself from morm and Aganzir.

Last chance: what is the reason for your continued suspicion? I keep asking you this. Why won't you answer?

No. You said I made automatic suspicion of you part of my argument. I have never done that, to you or anyone. If I do say I always suspect someone, it's to acknowledge my own bias. Besides, I don't always suspect you. What gave you that idea?

You understand the situation? Unless I vote for Gwath now, you're dead. That won't doom the village, the way the numbers are, but it would be a pity if you're innocent and he's the wolf, wouldn't it?

I think that this is an interesting theory, but that maybe it is too neat and tries to explain too many things at once? I don't know. It's plausible nonetheless. Points for creativity, sally!

My mistake. I forgot about ties and the current number of reps.

So she's dead. The question is, do I bring Gwath to a tie with her or not?

EDIT: clarifying a comment.

Then you should vote for the person who has been acting the most suspicious. if you think that's me, then you'll vote for me and nothing I'm going to say in the next five minutes or so is going to stop you. And technically I'm dead either way, unless the last two reps both vote for Gwath.


I'd really prefer if you'd stop talking about the way I'm acting and concentrate on someone else. Why else would I be so keen to brush you off, besides the obvious? I'd rather you use your time catching a wolf instead of talking about me. Assuming you're not the wolf, of course, but if you're not you would start thinking more about others and not just questioning everything I say.


My computer froze. You want I should try to make a post before deadline? And if so, tell me who and I'll do it, or at least try. Last full measure of devotion and all that business.

Posting now. Seeing what's happening

Well...I think that if I am going to be lynched, it should be done toMorrow. I've hardly been involved so far (I don't like big villages), and my death at this point would provide very little information regarding other players. Let me interact some more - I'll make a concerted effort - and that way my death will create a point of reference from which to judge other players.

Obviously, I'd rather not die at all, but since the idea seems to be something of a popular phenomenon, I'd at least like to be useful to the village in my demise.

In short, don't tie me up with sally!

Gwath: I'm only halfway reading his posts. Quite submarine-ish... but I haven't seen enough to make me willing to risk a double-lynch.

So

++lynch Sally.


EDIT: fixed highlight.
EDIT: X'd with Gwath.

Sorry- I fell asleep reading. Not feeling too well. Talk to everyone after the village has ended.

Aren't there five? Or are there four? Meh, won't make much of a difference now.



Quickly, on Brinn. The reason she jumped suddenly onto my suspicion list was how she reacted to the triple lynch plan. Yes, it was fallible, but unless Nerwen orI were the last wolf and incredibly stupid, it would have worked well (ntil Morm ruined it anyway). She just reacted in a strange manner and it set some major alarm bells off. Other than that it was just a general uneasiness. Sorry I don't have time to explain the way I'd intended, but "time don't wait for no one, leaving you broken, especially when you're under the gun." Alas.


Pretty sure I'm x'd with the mod lowering me into the guillotine, so alas, poor village. Catch the last wolf!

~~Sally~~

P.S. Can I actually have a guillotine in my narration? That'd totally make my day. :p

P.P.S. Prolly x'd even more now. Sorry, internet died again, but I may as well post this while I'm here.

Now that's a silly argument. Future interaction means nothing now. If you're a wolf, you have no fellows to interact with.

Awwww, poor kid. Get some sleep. Or sleep when you're dead. :Merisu:

*raises hand tentatively* Can I tell you I told you so yet? (As in told you to lynch the most suspicious sounding person, not necessarily not to lynch me or to lynch Gwath, although that was strongly implied heh)

Nope, only four. I thought there were five too. So I've been wasting my time with you, since you've been dead since Lommy voted you.

In fact, Nerwen, it makes a great deal of sense.

Why?

Well in that case....good to know. Heh well now I'm good and deaded.



Alternatively, we should probably be quiet now. Well, me more than most, but it's past deadline and we best not tempt the moddesses' wrath.


Bye!

By the way, I'm sure you can all guess what I was? ;)


Gwath's last statement. Awkward much?

All you had to do was ask.


This was my point, though it is irrelevant now, since it pertained to the question of killing me toDay:

If I am a wolf, then if I die, the village wins, obviously.

If I am innocent, then my death is going to help the village most if I have been interacting extensively with other players.

Conclusion: If I am the remaining wolf, I am not going to win by toMorrow, and so I may as well be left until then, when the village will either a) win, or b) have a more substantial point of reference from which to evaluate the other players.

Well, since you haven't admitted to being a wolf yet, I guess you were innocent, Sally. I hope you'll remember that I did give you a chance to defend yourself.

Oh, and 'bye, phantom. I'll miss you.

I'm so terribly sorry for leaving you hanging, everyone. I thought Fea was going to be back.

The game isn't over yet.

Dead:

Fea
Mith
Rikae
Diamond18 (ordo)
Legate (ordo)
McCaber (ordo)
Eönwë/Steve (ordo)
Aganzir (ordo)
Ka (wolf)
Shasta (ordo)
Mormegil (wolf)
Nogrod (wolf)
Boromir88 (seer)
Sally (ordo)

Alive:

Brinniel
Gil-Galad
Greenie
Gwathagor
Ilya
Lommy
Kath
Nerwen
Rune
the phantom

I'm sorry too I was going to drive somewhere with internet access afterwork but I suddenly felt ill and tired and just wanted to go home and sleep.... which I did and feel better for.