The forgotten Spiders of Mirkwood
 

In the Hobbit they were quite a big theme, even appearing on Thorin's map ('South lies Mirkwood the Great ~ there are Spiders); in LoTR, UT and the Appendixes they aren't even given a cursory reference.
A forgetful mistake, perhaps. It doesn't really matter much, but it's just one of those things that was never explained.

What needs to be explained; that they are never mentioned again? Should they be mentioned again? If so, why?

Far and wide her lesser broods...spread from glen to glen, from the Ephel Dúath, to the eastern hills, to Dol Guldur and the fastnesses of Mirkwood. But none could rival her, Shelob the Great, last child of Ungoliant to trouble the unhappy world.

That is the only reference to the Spiders of Mirkwood that I can find in LoTR. Fortunately, the Fellowship just never entered any areas where these "lesser broods" still lived. Until Sam and Frodo ran into the Big Mama herself, that is.

Too bad Legolas wasn't around. He'd proabably killed his share of spiders in his day. Maybe he could have given them some pointers.

I think it's more a question of perspective; from the point of view of Bilbo during his adventure (as well by the standards of 99% of the earth's population) an encounter with giant flesh-eating spiders in Mirkwood was a Great Adventure with capital letters. They were a real menace, to say the least, and any sensible mapmaker would be put "there are spiders" on his map as a sort of warning direction, rather like a medieval mapmaker writing "Here be dragons" albeit with considerably more justification.

That was "The Hobbit." In LOTR, none of the characters came within range of the spiders of Mirkwood, and though they doubtless knew of their existence, their importance probably seemed pretty negligible compared to say, the immediate threats you were facing while trudging up Sauron's Road, or the implications of seeing your former comrades' heads being catapulted into your besieged native city. And Shelob, of course, was enough to worry about without pausing to say "D'ye know, Mr. Frodo, I've been thinking that she-creature might have something to do with those nasty spiders as Mr. Bilbo talked about in his book." There was no point in talking about some distance menace when they had plenty of immediate ones.

As for why the spiders are mentioned in the Appendices, it's likely just because the spiders, while nasty, didn't really contribute much to any historical developments or tales. There isn't really much to say about them except "Yes, they're there. Try to avoid them if you can." Shelob had more legend surrounding her, but her children didn't seem to be so interested in that sort of thing. They were more for just waylaying and killing hapless travelers, and probably just never happened to get anyone sufficiently importantly to get themselves into the legends.

Yes, I think you're right. Thanks for helping me out with that matter.

Birdland, about those 'pointers,' would they have been barbed, steel-tipped pointers, coming right back at Shelob's clustered eyes? You do have a way with words! [img]smilies/biggrin.gif[/img]

Gwaihir, good question. I think part of the reason Tolkien didn't choose to mop up the mirkwood spiders or say if Shelob was killed or not: was to leave some adventures for the fourth age to 'enjoy.' (!) I think there's a letter with a quote to that effect, but I can't find the quote. I'm not sure why the Mirkwood spiders did not appear in the Tale of Years, RotK, 'battle under the trees of Mirkwood, Thranduil repels the forces of Dol Guldur.' It's so compressed I can't tell if the spiders were just too cowardly & debased to get involved, or if they joined in as they could. They would have felt no more loyalty to Dol Guldur than Shelob did to Mordor, but I'm sure they would have emerged for spoils had Dol Guldur won. Ungolient, mother of all these spiders, was very good at keeping her many-eyed head down while big bad Morgoth took the heat.

Considering Beren's, Bilbo's and Frodo's and Sam's encounters, Tolkien liked sicking giant spiders on his heroes so they could defeat the spiders cleverly and/or heroicly; I think he'd have liked the idea of future Shelob/Mirkwood-spider adventures in Middle Earth.

There's a Lost Tales version of Beren and Luthien's story in which they deal with spiders twice: not only does Beren make it by them to come into Doriath and meet Luthien, but after facing down both giant werewolf Carcharoth (sp) and Morgoth himself, they are trapped by spiders a second time. In that version, they're rescued by the hound Huan instead of the Eagles, but Tolkien seemed to have settled on the Eagles rescue/no spiders. It's a shame he didn't write more about Beren vs. the spiders in the mountains, I liked that part.

In the Silmarillion, it mentions that Ungoliant frightened even Melkor when she wanted the Silmarils(I forgot where). Ungoliant was definitely the mother of Shelob, and she was definitely the mother of the Mirkwood spiders. But in LOTR, it mentions husbands Shelob has killed. Now ponder for a moment, and consider this: where did her mates come from? Were they children of Ungoliant, or some other evil from too far back to remember? If you could enlighten me, I would be most grateful.

In ROTK (I haven't got it in front of me, but this is pretty close I think) Shelob's children are referred to as "bastards of her miserable mates, also her children, whom she slew." The implication is that Shelob plays Jocasta to her mates' Oedipus. Of course she had to have someone to have the original children with, since she probably didn't just bud. Maybe some relation of Ungoliant? Or possibly her own father? Frankly it's not difficult to believe of her.