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- - Denethor (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showthread.php?t=10050)

do you think they will show denethor go crazy and try to kill himself and faromir in the rotk movie

Since the Denethor-Faramir scenes are an integral part of the story, I don't think Peter Jackson would leave them out. That would honestly be really stretching it. By the way, isatri, next time you create a topic, use the search function at the top of the page to find out whether ones on the same topic already exist. I'm sure that there are quite a few Denethor threads or movie speculation threads open, so next time, check. It creates less clutter when you do that.

Well yeah! Why not! Denethor is so flaked out from palantir viewing, there's not much else for him to do! Seriously, I get slightly annoyed the way Denethor's far reaching "knowledge" and "vision" get mentioned practically every time his name comes up! Denethor's motto..."I knew that!" Anyway...that's a dramatic moment that will play well! It better be in there!

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>do you think they will show denethor go crazy and try to kill himself and faromir in the rotk movie <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Ask Meela.

There are quite a few threads which speculate on the upcoming RotK movie, so it's a good idea to use the search function (top right of page), enter Denethor and enjoy what comes up. However, since none of those are specifically about Denethor, this thread can continue. Please do give reasons for your answers or suggest ways you'd like to see it done.

Yes, ask Meela Meela happens to know that it will be shown. Well, she read an article where this guy was on set watching John Noble and David Wenham filming, and according to him or John Noble, everything happens, like Faramir almost getting toasted, etc. Plus, why on earth would it not happen? They can't really have Denethor live and show him smiling happily at Faramir's wedding...Can't find the article right now...

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> "So be it!" cried Denethor. "But not with your death only, Lord Faramir: with the death of also your father, and of all your people, whom it is your part to protect now that Boromir is gone." "Do you wish then," said Faramir, "that our places had been exchanged?" "Yes, I wish that indeed," said Denethor. "For Boromir was loyal to me and no wizard's pupil." Chapter 4, Part I, ROTK <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>I love Boromir (obviously) but that was totally uncalled for. Poor Faramir. They'd better put in that part with Denethor killing himself, cause I like that he died suffering. MWA HA HA HA HA!

I've posted on this very query a year or so ago on another forum.I predicted that they would NOT show the pyre scene. My main reasoning was how jackson could get this past the censors and still have a PG12 (english rating) movie?Evidence of this not happening might come from the fact that we see Pippin on shadowfax with gandalf as the witch king approaches MT on his winged beast? as we know, the main plot is that pippin stops gandalf at this very moment and calls him back to the citadel. how could he know what's happening if he's with gandalf?I hope I am wrong, and that you lot out there have a plausible reason for this. Or does this mean ANOTHER plot change from the book?

I was convinced that was the Witch King as well, but now that I've seen that pic of him (in another thread) it is clear that Gandalf and Pippin are facing another Nazgul.I would guess that the confrontation at the gates as already occured and Pippin and Gandalf are on their way to save Faramir when a second Nazgul blocks their way. Way to tighten the screws, PJ. Personally, I can't imagine how the scene won't be there. I can't see how else to resolve the Denethor character. People have been burned to death in PG-13 movies before, I doubt it will be an issue.H.C.

I don't think ratings will be an issue either because all PJ has to show is Denethor jumping into the fire and just have the flames jump up around him to make his death implied. It doesn't have to be graphic with burning flesh and screaming to get the point across.[ October 14, 2003: Message edited by: Silmiel of Imladris ]

I don't think there's any chance of PJ leaving that out. Changing a character's one thing, but that would be quite another.

I agree with all of you. How could PJ leave that scene out? I mean, if he didn't leave it in, then how are they going to get Denethor of the throne? There's evidence (pieces of the movie) of him saying that he will not bow to a ranger of the north (way to go, Denethor! ). And then, IF they don't let him die, after the war of the ring, he just stands down? "Sure Aragorn, all of the sudden, without a reason, I like you so much that I let you take you rightful place."? Sure.And, by the way, PJ wouldn't dare take that scene out. Think of Meela! I'm sure PJ's way to terrified to change anything about Denethor because of our beloved Denethor-obsessie... BTW, Meela, have you found the article yet?Navaer! Aethelwine.

Haven't found the article every time I really want to find something, I never can.*runs after PJ armed with a pitchfork*He won't change anything...

In Quickbeam's "Out on a Limb" section of the Greenbooks at theOneRing.net, he talks about visiting the shoot in NZ. He doesn't watch the shooting of Denethor's death, but sees the aftermath, charred floor and all. The "Ian" referred to in this passage is Ian McKellan, Quickbeam's tour guide, lucky Ent! <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> Down another hall I found myself in the Silent Street.... the Rath Dínen.... and within was a larger tomb where lay the Stewards of Minas Tirith. Fittingly, the space was quiet and grey. Only the work lights glowed softly overhead. With a glint in his eye, Ian said, "This is the leftover set where we filmed the Pyre of Denethor last week. I came crashing down that ramp on Shadowfax. Quite a dramatic entrance!" I admired the plywood walls, convincingly painted like ancient marble. Along the perimeter loomed a dozen bas relief figures "carved" into the wall. Nearly two meters tall, these specter-like forms were draped with robes covering all the features of the face. Each figure held a down-pointed sword. VERY chilling indeed! Lo and behold! Each tomb had a name and date below its mysterious Grim Reaper figure. I walked around the room, reading each one. They were accurate! These weren’t just made up names like Underdog or Henry Kissinger. I recognized them from Appendix A: ‘Annals of the Kings and Rulers.’ Mardil 2080 – Belecthor I 2655 – Ecthelion I 2698Brilliant! How totally brilliant to apply this much effort to something that will hardly register on the screen. When you sit in the theatre watching The Return of the King you probably won’t even notice them. So why put them there? Think about it: somebody at WETA spent a lot of time going through the Appendices and assigning very clever artisans to create gorgeous, creepy sculptures – with accurate nameplates. The object was for the actors to be surrounded by "history" and, for obvious reasons, to help center their performances. Fidelity of this grade is significant, I feel, and I would see plenty more of it during the rest of my visit. The room took on a new aura. I had a sense of true place. A raised platform stood center where the pyre had burned. It was charred and black. Although the props, fuel, and actors were gone the horror still weighed oppressively in the air. Denethor’s raging madness. The bloodshed. The screaming. I had to get out. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>If you want to read the rest of the story go here: <A HREF="http://greenbooks.theonering.net/quickbeam/files/nz_part1.html" TARGET=_blank>Where the Stars are Strange</A>-Lily

I don't see how they could not include that scene. The rating won't be a problem. I've seen a PG movie where someone was burned to death, you just don't see everything. Thay should definately be in there. I'm glad to know they filmed it!! At least Meela can relax a little. Arwen

Oh the scene will be included. I just found <A HREF="http://www.theonering.net/staticnews/1066104923.html" TARGET=_blank>this review of a 20 minute screening</A> on TORN. They probably had a non-disclosure clause so dont talk too much about stuff, but it does offer some insights.[ October 16, 2003: Message edited by: Arveleg ]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> People have been burned to death in PG-13 movies before, I doubt it will be an issue. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Yay! Now i dont mean ot sound morbid, but how much wouuld that up the emotional tempo of the movie!! Man im so excited about having my emotions torn about the place Ill have to invest in the Kleenex company.

Yes, I was interested in that 20 minute preview or whatever, but a few problems prevented me. First, I was in no mood to be attacked with language that would make an orc blush. Second, my computer doesn't handle video well...at ALL. Can you guys talk about it? Maybe one of you who has seen it can post a new post about it. I'm sure photos from it will be turning up on the net sooner or later.

What? You can see the footage? I thought it was just an article explaining the footage. If you do get photos, send them over to me at once!

I think <A HREF="http://www.theonering.net/scrapbook/group/1056/view/9175" TARGET=_blank>this</A> ends the debate.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> I think this ends the debate. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Nah, that's just Denethor being prudent and stocking up the wood supplies for a long seige. You see, he even got Faramir to lie on top of the stack to protect it.

Ah, mirth! Great call Saucepan, LOL! That is quite a bit of wood. Look at all those faggots!! Sorry, but you have to admit that's a word you don't often get to use as its original meaning. Is this grubby customer really supposed to be the Steward of Gondor, Lord of the White City and Commander of the armies of Minas Tirith?! I say burn him now, and next time don't forget to consult Alan Lee before releasing a character from the makeup hut.

He looks liked a poorly aged rock star...sort of. Keith Richards meets Ozzy = movie Denethor

Please don't let Meela catch you saying that... or you might wish you were wearing asbestos pants.