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-   -   How did Faramir know? (http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showthread.php?t=1667)

Lhunardawen 07-27-2003 08:18 PM

How did Faramir know?
 
I have been wondering about this for so long, ever since I finished reading RotK. How did Faramir know that Aragorn is the King after he was healed by him? They haven't seen each other before that happened, and I can't think of a possible reason why he easily recognized Aragorn as the king and called him so. Any explanations?

Gorwingel 07-27-2003 08:23 PM

Maybe it was because he did heal him and maybe Faramir knew that the heir of Isildur had healing powers. Maybe it was also because of his very kingly personality.

I do think that Faramir and Aragorn had met though, before the whole War of the Ring thing (though I could be terribly mistaken)

Lhunardawen 07-27-2003 08:34 PM

Oh, yes. Faramir has seen Aragorn, but he was very young then, and Aragorn was known as Thorongil.

Eomer of the Rohirrim 07-28-2003 09:22 AM

When Faramir was healed he probably had quite a good idea of the horrors he had just been through. He would have guessed that only the King could have brought him back from what he had experienced.

Lord of Angmar 07-28-2003 10:42 AM

Quote:

Maybe it was because he did heal him and maybe Faramir knew that the heir of Isildur had healing powers.
I agree, Gorwingel. In the book it says something along the lines of, "the hand of the King is the hand of the Healer" (I would provide the exact quote if I had a copy of RotK available). As a Son of Gondor and a Captain of her army, I am sure Faramir would know this quite well, and also perhaps his "Elvish" senses detected an aura of a man of the line of Elendil.

Lord of Angmar 07-28-2003 10:45 AM

Also, Faramir probably had tidings of Aragorn, from hints dropped by Frodo and Sam in Ithilien and because of the news of Boromir's death after his trip to Imladris, etc.

Kuruharan 07-28-2003 02:41 PM

Quote:

Oh, yes. Faramir has seen Aragorn, but he was very young then, and Aragorn was known as Thorongil.
Indeed, Faramir was an incredibly young man when Aragorn served Ecthelion II as Thorongil. Faramir was a whopping -3 at the time.

I think the healing combined with an innate sense of just "knowing" was what tipped him off.

Turambar 07-28-2003 03:11 PM

It's almost impossible to find a plot hole in Tolkien, but this sure seems like one. The explanations given above aren't very compelling.

tinewelt 07-28-2003 03:30 PM

Quote:

suddenly Faramir stirred, and he opened his eyes, and he looked on Aragorn who bent over him; and a light of knowledge and love was kindled in his eyes, and he spoke softly 'My lord, you called me. I come. What does the king command?
of course we do not know this for certain, but my guess is that when Aragorn "called" Faramir, he (faramir) probably heard as well as seen Aragorn as a vision, and knew that he was king. As already stated, he knew the hands of the king were the hands of a healer. Also, when the quote says Faramir had a light of knowledge and love kindled in his eyes, I am guessing that knowledge was given to him at that moment that Aragorn was in fact the king. Maybe given by Illuvatar himself!!??? who knows. [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img]

The Saucepan Man 07-28-2003 05:08 PM

Quote:

Also, Faramir probably had tidings of Aragorn, from hints dropped by Frodo and Sam in Ithilien
Indeed he did. From The Window on the West:

Quote:

"So!" said Faramir. "I wish then to learn from you more of it; for what concerns Boromir concerns me ... Had you this thing in keeping? It is hidden, you say; but is not that because you choose to hide it?"

"No, not because I choose," answered Frodo. "It does not belong to me. It does not belong to any mortal, great or small; though if any could claim it, it would be Aragron son of Arathorn, whom I named, leader of our Company from Moria to Rauros."

"Why so, and not Boromir, prince of the City that the sons of Elendil founded?"

"Because Aragorn is descended in direct lineage, father to father, from Isildur Elendil's son himself. And the sword that he bears was Elendil's sword."
OK, so that does not explain how Faramir recognised the healer that he saw when he awoke as Aragorn, the man whom Frodo had told him was Isildur's heir and therefore rightful heir to the throne of Gondor. But he would have realised from his conversation with Frodo that Aragorn was likely to show up in Minas Tirith claiming his throne. This knowledge, combined with Aragorn's obvious healing skills, and Faramir's innate awareness suggested by the quote given by tinewelt seems sufficient to me, without more, to justify his recognition of his King.

Morgoth the Great 07-28-2003 08:05 PM

"The Hands of a healer are the hands of a king, thus spoke Ioref-wisewoman of the city" Faramir would of known that only the king could of recalled him from the black breath

Maeglanthirion 07-29-2003 12:00 AM

I agree with Morgoth the Great. That quote i remember from the book. The hands of the Healer thing should have been quite a large hint that Aragorn was King. Being son of Denethor, he would definately know about this.

lindil 07-29-2003 12:09 AM

In addition to the above reasons [excepting Faramir and thorondil meeting [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img] ] I would only add that Aragorn would obviously appear as Dunedain nobility, and if I recall wearing the Star of Elendil as a clasp.

So how many Dundeain nobles in Gondor did faramir not know?

Osse 07-29-2003 02:00 AM

We must take into account that aragorn healed not only with his body, but with his mind. He gives us this impression when he talks to the people he had cured; "i called long for you." (please excuse rough quotes) " i searched for you and pulled you from the darkness".

When he was 'calling' to faramir, i always imagined him saying something along the lines of; "Faramir, come back to the light. I am Elessar, your king, and i command it."
(perhaps not exactly like that but it's hard to explain nes pas?)

This is not a plot hole, but allows use of the readers imagination. If you look at it purely on what was said and done, there is enough to spur your imagination, yet (as someone said above, but i heartily disagree) not enough to just use the facts. Even without using my imagination i am convinced.

Osse

Lhunardawen 08-02-2003 01:32 AM

Wow, Osse, I haven't thought of it that way. I am not sure if it happened that way but there is a possibility.

[img]smilies/biggrin.gif[/img]

Feanor of the Peredhil 08-02-2003 06:28 PM

Boromir claimed to 'see Frodo's mind', so perhaps Faramir could see Aragorn's.

On a more serious note, as was aforementioned, Ioreth's quippings were probably well known. Add that to his knowledge given by Frodo, his ability to see people's minds and intentions (handed down by his dear old pyromaniac dad), and the fact that Aragorn had somehow managed to pull him from the jaws of death, I'd say that there was a good chance that Faramir could put 27 and 34 together and come up with 61. (I refrain from 2+2 because it was slightly more complicated than that.) Or it was just the sort of thing that you 'know'.

Fea


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