[Child of the 7th Age]

Littlemanpoet -- Thanks for your speedy reply and perceptions about this. You make many good points, but I still think something is going on which is more than meets the eye, at least in certain instances.

How else can you explain the scene in "Many Partings" where Gandalf, Galadrel, Celeborn, and Elrond speak at length after the Hobbits have gone to sleep? Can this be understood any other way except telepathic communication?:

For they did not move or speak with mouth, looking from mind to mind; and only their shining eyes stirred and kindled as their thoughts went to and fro.

This is one instance where I don't think a person could argue that it was just someone's subconscious thoughts influencing them, as might be true in some other scenes.

And if you agree that the above is telepathic communication, it opens the door to many possible questions about other incidents in the book, which perhaps may be construed more than one way. Perhaps only the Maia and the greatest of Elves could do this.

You admit the posibility that Pippin may have had a psychic experience of some kind, but isn't that exactly what mind-to-mind communication would be?

Interestingly, the example you mentioned about the Phial of Galadriel has another part to it, even earlier, which again sounds like an example of words coming from outside Frodo into his mind and then out of his mouth:

Frodo gazed in wonder at this marvellous gift that he had so long carried, not guessing its full worth and potency. Seldom had he remembered it on the road until they came to Morgul Vale, and never had he used it for fear of its revealing light. "Aiya Earedil Elenion Ancalima!" he cried, and knew not what he had spoken; for it seemed that another voice spoke through his , clear, untroubled by the foul air of the pit.

A few lines down, the author tells us that the spider "had heard the Elves cry that cry far back in the deeps of time, and she had not heeded it and it did not daunt her now."


Can anyone translate this Elvish? My book does not. I assume it is referring to the mariner Earendil who was placed as a star in the sky, and that the phial itself reflected some of that light. Who placed these words in Frodo's mind and mouth? Earendil, Galadriel, the Valar, Frodo's subconscious.....? I am really lost here, but it could be a message that comes from outside of himself.

And, if Gandalf can chat with the Elves from mind to mind after the Ring is destroyed and send a warning long distance to Frodo at Amon Hen, surely Saruman would have similar powers, and why wouldn't he use them (i,e, abuse them!) to influence others?

Let me hasten to add that I have no background or particular interest in psychic manifestations in "real life", but the conversation between Gandalf and the Elves seemed like such a striking example. Undoubtedly a hobbit like Pippin or Frodo only had a tiny, latent piece of the skill of someone like Galadriel, Elrond, or Celeborn but couldn't that tiny piece be there and come out when they are in a very dangerous situation or, in the case of Frodo, when he is under the influence of the Ring.

Is there anything in the histories of Middle-earth which addresses this question, or other writings by Tolkien that I'm not aware of? sharon, the 7th age hobbit