[HerenIstarion]

Nice topic,Child [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img], and I’d like to make few comments, if you don’t mind [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img], and chiefly on Raven_Winter’s post concerning “elffriendliness” and light caused by it.

by raven_winter

The Elves are practically pure spirit,

not then and there, for:

when we name you "Children of
Eru" we do not speak lightly; for that name we do not utter ever
in jest or without full intent. When we speak so, we speak out of knowledge, not out of mere Elvish lore; and we proclaim that ye
are our kin, in a kinship far closer (both of hroa and fea) than
that which binds together all other creatures of Arda, and
ourselves to them.

Finrod to Andreth

hroar of Men and Elves are almost the same, otherwise marriages between them would have been impossible, or, rather, fruitless.

and:

by raven_winter
They glow faintly with "starlight" because it is a mark of their higher nature.

I’d say it marks those wise, sad because of much pain seen and uncorrupt. Starlight glow of Maeglin looks rather doubtful, don’t you think?

As for the higher nature, I’m not quite sure what is meant by that, yet:

But he desired rather to subdue to his will both Elves and Men, envying the gifts with which Ilúvatar promised to endow them; and he wished himself to have subject and servants, and to be called Lord, and to be a master over other wills.

Morgoth envies both kindreds, and the spirit of the whole sentence suggests equality of those gifts to both elves and Men, if not in kind, at least in status. Yet, still more:

But the sons of Men die indeed, and leave the world; wherefore they are called the Guests, or the Strangers. Death is their fate, the gift of Ilúvatar, which as Time wears even the Powers shall envy.

This suggests than even the Valar have lesser fate than Men, so what about elves?

by raven_winterAragorn is an Elf-Friend, yet he doesn't shine

Well, neither Frodo, literally speaking, does shine all the way. As was stated here already, he shines for those with eyes to see. Only Goldberry sees it. (mind you, I’m not concerned with later glittering and transparency caused partly by morgul wound and partly by the Ring) Who knows, what would she have said on seeing Aragorn?

by raven_winter
I think that he was trying to comfort Frodo and give him some assurance that the Elves in the surrounding region would hear of his plight and his need for assistance, and further, that the Elves would be on the look-out for him, as well as the Black Riders.

Well, I can’t agree. Gildor says plainly enough, that elves indeed would be on the look out for Frodo, and word will be sent to Wandering Companies. What is the need of repeating thing already talked over in plain words, and in obscure hints at that? Still, calling someone pal does not mean going to rob a bank in his stead, until it is said and agreed. Or suppose I’m an elf wandering through the Shire. I may see many people, and know lot of them, yet they are not the least closer to being named elf-friend than some Stoors left away in the East in the Anduin’s Vale that I have never heard of. They knew Bilbo already in Rivendell, when he first arrived there with dwarves and Gandalf, but he was not an elf-friend until Thranduil entitled him so.

Almost the same can be said about explanation of Goldberry’s words:

by raven_winter

I think that this was simply Goldberry's way of greatly complementing Frodo by comparing him with so fair a race as the Elves and putting him at ease

First of all, to put all of them at ease remark was made, that “nothing passes this door and windows save wind and starlight” (not exact citation, yet something not very short of the mark) Another thing is that, to make a complement, one has to have something to start with. As well as Gandalf can’t burn snow with his wand, you can’t make a sound complement if even the smallest grain of thing to be praised is not there. I would have called a liar any one who dared to say I looked handsome last Sunday, for I looked not [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img]. Same, you don’t suppose Goldberry was lying?

by raven_winter
The light that Frodo perceives in Strider's face when they are standing on the mound of Cerin Amroth -- well, that's just pure love

that maybe true enough, but the word just in the context seems out of place. Remaining in deepest hope I was not harsh as an old crow

truly yours [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img]

[ May 02, 2002: Message edited by: HerenIstarion ]

[ May 02, 2002: Message edited by: HerenIstarion ]

[ May 02, 2002: Message edited by: HerenIstarion ]