Quote:
There was a way to leave Aman and go to Middle-earth. Did you completely skip the bit where Fingolfin's company marched across Helcaraxë?
|
Oh, come on. That was hardly a realistic option. They didn't even know it was possible and when they tried it a bunch of them died. If you want to talk about how lives could be saved, the Noldor crossing the ice certainly wouldn't do that (and they wouldn't get back to Beleriand in time to save it from Morgoth's first invasion).
Quote:
Whether or not the journey there was aided, the Valar had no obligation to take them back.
|
Yes, and if my friend gets drunk, I have no obligation to give him a ride, but I do because I can see the consequences of what could happen if he tried to get home on his own (even if it was his own stupid fault for getting drunk, but in Feanor's case, he was a bit "drunk" by no fault of his own but rather the slaying of his father, the rape of his treasure, and the lies of Morgoth).
So I guess I'm a more decent chap than the Valar.
Quote:
Feanor's Noldor "should" have built their own ships, or marched on like Fingolfin's Noldor did, or stayed in Valinor.
|
And which one of these actions would have got the Noldor back to ME in time to save Beleriand? Umm...none of them.
Quote:
Eru's will would be done in the end no matter what. We have no basis to say what would've happened if the Noldor hadn't have gone back to Middle-earth. Morgoth would've been defeated one way or another.
|
Well, I guess the last point doesn't mean anything if you honestly believe that whatever Eru wants to happen will happen no matter what. (I personally believe that things happen Eru's way, but that he inspires his creations to bring them about. They do the work.)
But if we use your theory that Eru makes everything happen the way it's supposed to no matter what, then no one should ever do anything.
The Valar should've never gone to war against Melkor because if it was Eru's will that Melkor be chained then it would happen anyway. The Valar should've never fortified their land because if it was in Eru's plan for them to be safe then they would be automatically. They should've never made the trees because if Eru wanted there to be light it would've happened.
Obviously that's all ridiculous. In order to bring those designs to life, action had to be taken. Eru only acts personally if absolutely necessary.
Was there any different action that Feanor and the Noldor could've taken to still bring about the exact good they accomplished? Not that I can see.
The Valar, on the other hand, could've done something to preserve the good the Noldor accomplished while at the same time preventing the kin slaying (they could've done that by just taking the Noldor to ME, same good accomplished, the bad part skipped).
In other words, Feanor accomplished the good he accomplished by the only means possible (unless the Valar were to help). The only way the good still happens without the bad is if the Valar assist the Noldor.
That is unless you use the philosophy that everything would happen right anyway, but I've already shown my justifiable disbelief in that notion.
I'm not asking anyone to call Feanor perfect or say the Valar are evil, but I'd just like everyone to admit that the way things happened left Feanor with little choice on courses to take to fulfill his mission, and that the Valar maybe should've seen the bad stuff coming and definitely could've made the whole situation a lot easier.