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Rumil · 07-10-2003, 02:29 PM

Saruman's 'devices', nice point! While I'm sure Saruman could and did construct siege engines such as mangonels, rams, trebuchets, ballistae etc. there would surely have been difficulties transporting these through the thick pine forests surrounding Dol Guldur. Perhaps some of the smaller engines were broken down and transported by pack animal?

I'd imagine that Saruman's devices consisted of explosive charges of the 'they have lit the fires of Orthanc beneath us' sort, and that Gandalf may well have contributed something similar. (I was going to speculate on Gandalf's rocketry experience, but found I was about to propose a Middle Earth Tomahawk cruise missile, so I won't!).

Gwaihir, I know there's no real backup for my 'girdle extending' theory. I was inspired by the passage in Lorien where the 'light' of Lothlorien appeared to be opposing the 'dark' of Dol Guldur.

I also found a couple of extra things out. One was that at the time of the War of the Ring, Dol Guldur was occupied by a force sevenfold its previous garrison. This would fit with Mans' idea that Dol Guldur was a weak decoy outpost, perhaps Sauron had been sending troops to Mordor secretly for some time beforehand? I also found the rather extraordinary claim by Galadriel that she could percieve the thoughts of Sauron, or at least all of those concerning elves. That's really quite an advantage! I wonder if Gandalf could do something similar?

I'm still not convinced that Elrond and Thranduil sent any troops. Gandalf felt the need to explain the attack to Elrond (on Bilbo's way home) and I'd imagine Thranduil's forces were too busy partying, interrogating Dwarves and setting off to Erebor to worry about Dol Guldur.

I know what you mean about the situation of Dol Guldur within a forest. It does somehow fit the 'evil guy's secret hideaway' stereotype quite well, they always seem to hang out in rather inaccesible places, extinct volcanos, islands, extinct volcanos on islands ( I'm thinking Bond villains and Dr.Evil here).

I'll move on to The Battle of the Five Armies next, but please feel free to post on whichever subject you fancy as it'll be a while before I sort my next post out!

[ July 10, 2003: Message edited by: Rumil ]

07-10-2003, 02:29 PM	#11
Rumil Sage & Onions Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Britain Posts: 893	Saruman's 'devices', nice point! While I'm sure Saruman could and did construct siege engines such as mangonels, rams, trebuchets, ballistae etc. there would surely have been difficulties transporting these through the thick pine forests surrounding Dol Guldur. Perhaps some of the smaller engines were broken down and transported by pack animal? I'd imagine that Saruman's devices consisted of explosive charges of the 'they have lit the fires of Orthanc beneath us' sort, and that Gandalf may well have contributed something similar. (I was going to speculate on Gandalf's rocketry experience, but found I was about to propose a Middle Earth Tomahawk cruise missile, so I won't!). Gwaihir, I know there's no real backup for my 'girdle extending' theory. I was inspired by the passage in Lorien where the 'light' of Lothlorien appeared to be opposing the 'dark' of Dol Guldur. I also found a couple of extra things out. One was that at the time of the War of the Ring, Dol Guldur was occupied by a force sevenfold its previous garrison. This would fit with Mans' idea that Dol Guldur was a weak decoy outpost, perhaps Sauron had been sending troops to Mordor secretly for some time beforehand? I also found the rather extraordinary claim by Galadriel that she could percieve the thoughts of Sauron, or at least all of those concerning elves. That's really quite an advantage! I wonder if Gandalf could do something similar? I'm still not convinced that Elrond and Thranduil sent any troops. Gandalf felt the need to explain the attack to Elrond (on Bilbo's way home) and I'd imagine Thranduil's forces were too busy partying, interrogating Dwarves and setting off to Erebor to worry about Dol Guldur. I know what you mean about the situation of Dol Guldur within a forest. It does somehow fit the 'evil guy's secret hideaway' stereotype quite well, they always seem to hang out in rather inaccesible places, extinct volcanos, islands, extinct volcanos on islands ( I'm thinking Bond villains and Dr.Evil here). I'll move on to The Battle of the Five Armies next, but please feel free to post on whichever subject you fancy as it'll be a while before I sort my next post out! [ July 10, 2003: Message edited by: Rumil ] __________________ Rumil of Coedhirion