The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum - View Single Post - Barrow-Wights

Man-of-the-Wold · 02-09-2002, 03:18 AM

Yea, I see now. The last two posts were very constructive. The original Bestiary was a favorite of mine as a kid, although it makes mistakes, like equating the Silvan Elves with the Avari, even though the back of the Silmirillion clearly indicates them as Nandorin. I mean, really!

But I guess the bodies of Cardolan nobility were inhabited in a sense, and indeed a LotR appendix does note Frodo's Barrow as that of the last prince. Whether that means the body was the Prince's body is not definite. But still, there bodies were just a shell, taken over by spirits issuing out of Angmar in some form, presumably in the time between the Great Plague and the overthrow of Fornost.

I think that everyone agrees that these are not elf, orc or hobbit spirits. The dwarf idea is interesting, since between Gundabad and other places, Angmar certainly conquered some Dwarfish settlements, but I think not in that Tolkien says plainly in reference to the seven rings that Dwarves could not be reduced to shadows.

No, I think those spirits, which to one degree or another may have animated and possessed the newer Barrow corpses, were either minor Maiar spirits long corrupted by Morgoth, and somehow revived for the service of the Witch-King. Or, they are the spirits of corrupted Men of Carn Dûm, whose bodies have died, but through evil spells have lost their ticket beyond the Circles of the World. This in a sense is different from the Nazgûl or the Voice of Sauron, who are men whose bodies have simply withered away or been refashioned in some way.

How's that sound?

02-09-2002, 03:18 AM	#31
Man-of-the-Wold Wight Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: With Tux, dread poodle of Pinnath Galin Posts: 239	Yea, I see now. The last two posts were very constructive. The original Bestiary was a favorite of mine as a kid, although it makes mistakes, like equating the Silvan Elves with the Avari, even though the back of the Silmirillion clearly indicates them as Nandorin. I mean, really! But I guess the bodies of Cardolan nobility were inhabited in a sense, and indeed a LotR appendix does note Frodo's Barrow as that of the last prince. Whether that means the body was the Prince's body is not definite. But still, there bodies were just a shell, taken over by spirits issuing out of Angmar in some form, presumably in the time between the Great Plague and the overthrow of Fornost. I think that everyone agrees that these are not elf, orc or hobbit spirits. The dwarf idea is interesting, since between Gundabad and other places, Angmar certainly conquered some Dwarfish settlements, but I think not in that Tolkien says plainly in reference to the seven rings that Dwarves could not be reduced to shadows. No, I think those spirits, which to one degree or another may have animated and possessed the newer Barrow corpses, were either minor Maiar spirits long corrupted by Morgoth, and somehow revived for the service of the Witch-King. Or, they are the spirits of corrupted Men of Carn Dûm, whose bodies have died, but through evil spells have lost their ticket beyond the Circles of the World. This in a sense is different from the Nazgûl or the Voice of Sauron, who are men whose bodies have simply withered away or been refashioned in some way. How's that sound? __________________ The hoes unrecked in the fields were flung, __ and fallen ladders in the long grass lay __ of the lush orchards; every tree there turned __ its tangled head and eyed them secretly, __ and the ears listened of the nodding grasses; __ though noontide glowed on land and leaf, __ their limbs were chilled.