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Bêthberry · 06-24-2002, 07:34 AM

Child of the 7th Age,

This is an aside to the discussion of Frodo, but it is related to that Timmons article you mention.

Does Timmons restrict his article to hobbits or does he discuss Eowyn? It strikes me that Eowyn's first view of Aragorn in "The King of the Golden Hall" is one part which disproves the argument that there is no "sex" in Tolkien. To me, it is a stunningly understated depiction of the first, awakening experience of sexual attraction, in a healthy, positive sense, not in a pornographic sense, "hiding a power that she yet felt."

Mark12_30,

There is a woman with this kind of power in each of the refuges the Fellowship finds--the House of Bombadil, Rivendell, Lothlorien. I wonder if the "less keen and lofty" delight can be related to the particular nature of the Bombadil household rather than to Frodo's interest in Goldberry herself, though. Is the House of Bombadil a kind of pre-lapsarian place?

I'm not so sure I would take Frodo's bachelorhood as evidence of his unswerving fealty to Goldberry. (I take it this is what you meant; if I have misunderstood, please excuse and enlighten me!) In "The Shadow of the Past", after Bilbo has left, there is lots of evidence that Frodo is called to other things than those available through the usual domestic routines of the hobbits. He's got 'itchy feet' you might say. Then, after he has returned from the Quest, he is so changed that he in effect lives on another plane. Hence his journey West.

I have always regreted that Goldberry disappears so completely from the picture. When Gandalf refuses to return to the Shire, he expresses his desire to find companionship with Tom, but there is no mention of Goldberry. Does this suggest something--the loss of female voice--in the scoured Shire and the age of Man?

Regards,
Bethberry

06-24-2002, 07:34 AM	#67
Bêthberry Cryptic Aura Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 6,003	Child of the 7th Age, This is an aside to the discussion of Frodo, but it is related to that Timmons article you mention. Does Timmons restrict his article to hobbits or does he discuss Eowyn? It strikes me that Eowyn's first view of Aragorn in "The King of the Golden Hall" is one part which disproves the argument that there is no "sex" in Tolkien. To me, it is a stunningly understated depiction of the first, awakening experience of sexual attraction, in a healthy, positive sense, not in a pornographic sense, "hiding a power that she yet felt." Mark12_30, There is a woman with this kind of power in each of the refuges the Fellowship finds--the House of Bombadil, Rivendell, Lothlorien. I wonder if the "less keen and lofty" delight can be related to the particular nature of the Bombadil household rather than to Frodo's interest in Goldberry herself, though. Is the House of Bombadil a kind of pre-lapsarian place? I'm not so sure I would take Frodo's bachelorhood as evidence of his unswerving fealty to Goldberry. (I take it this is what you meant; if I have misunderstood, please excuse and enlighten me!) In "The Shadow of the Past", after Bilbo has left, there is lots of evidence that Frodo is called to other things than those available through the usual domestic routines of the hobbits. He's got 'itchy feet' you might say. Then, after he has returned from the Quest, he is so changed that he in effect lives on another plane. Hence his journey West. I have always regreted that Goldberry disappears so completely from the picture. When Gandalf refuses to return to the Shire, he expresses his desire to find companionship with Tom, but there is no mention of Goldberry. Does this suggest something--the loss of female voice--in the scoured Shire and the age of Man? Regards, Bethberry __________________ I’ll sing his roots off. I’ll sing a wind up and blow leaf and branch away.