Thread: Evil things
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Old 04-04-2004, 02:05 PM   #96
HerenIstarion
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Well, if I were calling up to Eckhart, it was unconsciously so, for I've tried to lean on Tolkien for the most part . It may be counted as a compliment to yours truly, if my conclusions somehow parallel his. Thanks a lot

Magic re: point taken. It may well be the case. So, it may be summarised as:

Magic is natural to those who exhibit ability to it (the group to contain elves and [incarnate] maiar) [It is my personal opinion that such an innate ability should not be called amgic at all]. It is, as any innate ability is, one of the tools in realization of creatures' likeness to its Creator in things it is entitled to, among which is subcreative capacity. The ability to subcreation is inherent ot all children of Eru. Elves remodel the Past, with Preservation in view as the main ends of it. Men seek Change in their subcreative excersises (reasons to be given below).

Participation of other minds in human subcreation re: may well be the case.

Jet engines re: nastiness and sidekicks get traditional reward of competent rebuff. But, on the other hand, if we again lean on Tolkien, such a thing as a jet engine would have been clearly condemned as Morgoth's invention indeed. (cf steel dragons and machines in the siege of Gondolin in the first versions of the story and description of technocivilisation allegedly invented by goblins in later times as stated in The Hobbit, also Mythopoeia, or Philomythus to Misomythus)

Freedom re:

Quote:
So, even if every potential possibility is contained in the contending themes, only men will have the freedom of thought to make use of those possibilities.
in which we come back to Atrabeth again, where those possibilities and freedom of thought in actualasing those are, by implication, stated to be the built-in image or pattern the men carry inside them of the Arda Remade:

Quote:
'Is it, then, a vision of what was designed to be when Arda
was complete - of living things and even of the very lands and
seas of Arda made eternal and indestructible, for ever beautiful
and new - with which the fëar of Men compare what they see
here? Or is there somewhere else a world of which all things
which we see, all things that either Elves or Men know, are only
tokens or reminders?'
Sounds even a bit platonic, then . The most explicit hint of Heaven ever to be found in Tolkien, as far as I know.

Being textual evidence, it can not be gainsaid. So, I again stress upon novelty as in the eye of the beholder - new things men bring about being new this side of the turnpike. Hence human longing, inability to stay quiet at most blessed places, constant seek for something new, to be enjoyed briefly and than thrown away, for everything reminds, but nothing is the real thing. And which may well underlie all of human subcreation. And such a disharmony being the result of the Fall (for otherwise, the bringing of 'new' things would be conscious, with the clear purpose in mind, but for the Fall, of which (in ME) the Death is a release.

But well, I have to agree, this side of said turnpike of death inevitably looks new even when Men are not conscious what are they about at all. But it is intended novelty - intended by Eru with direct insertion of human theme into the great Music before time.

So, human ability of novelty is destined as well as elven ability of preservation. Both are stated as each races' respective function. When I'm designed to do new things, and new things I do are designed by the same to design me, with clear goal in mind (of bringing Arda Remade into being) are they new to Him who designed them? For they are certainly new to me, and my mates (and if this novelty you've tried to indicate, than we have nothing to argue about in this respect). But back to design and function - extending it more, I conclude that the only freedom I can exercise when talking about my functioning is either to do it or not (when I'm an incarnate fëa, that is, I can only function without so much leisure or so much burden as the choice is, when I am an ork).

Choice, choice is the only true freedom.

Freedom to shape my life beyong the fate of Arda is built-in and predestined - for if men were tied inside old one, how could they participate in building of the new one? But as such a function is not percieved by any man of ME when alive, as they are mainly concerned with doing s of Arda, and [such a function] is rumored to be the lore of few wise men among them, then, I assume, function of 'Arda Remade builder' unfolds itself after death. Hence death, logically, is seen as means of freedom to shape one's fate beyond that of Arda and its main expression for all we know

Cheers
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