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**lindil** · 03-30-2003, 06:09 PM

The Letters [many references]
The Athrabeth ah Finrod Andreth [in Morgoth's Ring-HoME/X

The Silmarillion in general [but few specifics].

The Road goes Ever on, has an excellent little 'essay', on the devotional meanings behind A elberth Gilthoniel, and the High-Elves' pilgrimage to The White Towers.

Osanwe-Kenta less directly speaks of the spiritual faculties of Men, Elves and Ainur in regards to Morgoth's ability to decieve and corrupt.[you can order this from www.elvish.org for a mrere 2$ ]

Those are off the top of my head the primary references to men's [ or elves] religious practices and spiritual faculties.

An interesting tie-in with the real world is the poem 'Imram' of St. Brendan voyaging to 'Faerie' in HoME IX [Sauron defeated]

Also, no small point, is that Tolkien follows the distinction used in the Orthodox Church and Roman Catholicism of differentiating between asking a 'heavenly being' whether Vala- Angel or saint for help/intercession [acknowledging in humility that they may well have put less obstructions between God and themselves or have direct powers from God [by extension of Grace] and be able to aid one.

This is not however worship, which alone is due to God. There are specific theological terms used in greek [and probably Latin as well] that recognize these different aspects of heavenly interaction and Worship, Protestants however are less comfortable and historically rooted in all of this and in general do not follow the Ecumenical Council of the first Millenia of the Church which actually put any outside the Church who denies the grace of God within the Saints, and the appropriateness of our supplicating and venerating [not worshiping] the Saints and Angels. So Tolkien was imbedding a very important theological distinction within the primitive Theology of M-E. It is 'primitive' Monotheism yes, but not primitive protestant Monotheism.

And indeed As the Athrabeth and it's commentary show the seeds of the Trinity are already sown in the 'greater Silmarillion'.

[ March 30, 2003: Message edited by: lindil ]

03-30-2003, 06:09 PM	#5
lindil Seeker of the Straight Path Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: a hidden fastness in Big Valley nor cal Posts: 1,680	The Letters [many references] The Athrabeth ah Finrod Andreth [in Morgoth's Ring-HoME/X The Silmarillion in general [but few specifics]. The Road goes Ever on, has an excellent little 'essay', on the devotional meanings behind A elberth Gilthoniel, and the High-Elves' pilgrimage to The White Towers. Osanwe-Kenta less directly speaks of the spiritual faculties of Men, Elves and Ainur in regards to Morgoth's ability to decieve and corrupt.[you can order this from www.elvish.org for a mrere 2$ ] Those are off the top of my head the primary references to men's [ or elves] religious practices and spiritual faculties. An interesting tie-in with the real world is the poem 'Imram' of St. Brendan voyaging to 'Faerie' in HoME IX [Sauron defeated] Also, no small point, is that Tolkien follows the distinction used in the Orthodox Church and Roman Catholicism of differentiating between asking a 'heavenly being' whether Vala- Angel or saint for help/intercession [acknowledging in humility that they may well have put less obstructions between God and themselves or have direct powers from God [by extension of Grace] and be able to aid one. This is not however worship, which alone is due to God. There are specific theological terms used in greek [and probably Latin as well] that recognize these different aspects of heavenly interaction and Worship, Protestants however are less comfortable and historically rooted in all of this and in general do not follow the Ecumenical Council of the first Millenia of the Church which actually put any outside the Church who denies the grace of God within the Saints, and the appropriateness of our supplicating and venerating [not worshiping] the Saints and Angels. So Tolkien was imbedding a very important theological distinction within the primitive Theology of M-E. It is 'primitive' Monotheism yes, but not primitive protestant Monotheism. And indeed As the Athrabeth and it's commentary show the seeds of the Trinity are already sown in the 'greater Silmarillion'. [ March 30, 2003: Message edited by: lindil ] __________________ The dwindling Men of the West would often sit up late into the night exchanging lore & wisdom such as they still possessed that they should not fall back into the mean estate of those who never knew or indeed rebelled against the Light.