[davem]

Originally Posted by Bb

Congratulations, davem, for taking the thread so completely off topic. We were not discussing what belongs in the Legendarium, but what we mean by the word "canon". 'Canon' is not equivalent with "Legendarium."

From SpM to Fordim to my own posts, three of us have offerred definitions of that word in testimony to our point here--a definition which you have ignored and even studiously obfuscated.

I think if you read Obloquy's post (no 5) you'll see where this 'canon' question arose.

There is a Middle-earth 'canon' - writings by Tolkien (& Christopher as well now) which are about Middle-earth. The question is which writings belong in it & what relevance they have. Therefore it is a question of canonicity in that sense. This thread is about what we mean when we use the term 'canon' in relation to Tolkien's writings. If we're simply going to accept the dictionary definition of 'canon' this thread is meaningless. Canon is defined (Merriam-webster) as:
a sanctioned or accepted group or body of related works <the canon of great literature> Hence one can talk about the Middle-earth 'canon' (or Legendarium if you like.)

A children's tale that bore traces of Tolkien's own academic reading, lore, and languages is what got him going and what stimulated his publishers into getting him to write more. These are facts of publishing history. Maybe academics are embarassed about the significance of childish things to adults?

This is not relevant to the point I'm making - which is how or if TH is a primary text within the M-e 'canon' - or whether it actually belongs there at all.

Tolkien himself was uncomfortable with the condescending tone of TH - the knowing wink to the adults in the adults in the audience, what he called the 'pigwiggenry' (On Fairy Stories) - which is what we see in the early parts of TH/ In fact, as Flieger pointed out it was after the writing of TH that he wrote that essay. Certainly he never wrote in that 'style' again - if he had no problem with that 'tone' why not?

Originally Posted by Lalwende

Even if Tolkien himself did not think the style was coherent with the style of LotR and The Sil, it is still part of the Legendarium because it concerns plots, characters and places which we come across within other parts of the legendarium, and not just tangentially, but directly and extensively.

Its a story that makes use of the Legendarium. & which Tolkien attempted to integrate into it at a later date. Whether he succeeded or not is the question.