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Originally Posted by littlemanpoet
You consider this a fall by orcs?
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Depends. The bad guys, back in the day, used to be the big valar type, attacking the strongholds of the other 'gods,' breaking pillars of light, perverting elves into orcs and having Balrog's as cohorts (they even had their own jackets). By the time we get to the end of the Third Age, we have an eyeball, orcs with tan-lines and trolls with speech and an extensive knowledge of the culinary arts. So I'd say,
fall.
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But that would render Frodo a killer, which would drastically change the kind of character he had become. Not even Peter Jackson for an action oriented modern flick, could stoop that low.
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Well, that's the insult of all insults...
And I considered what you've stated right after I posted, and starting thinking how to (1) dig my way out of this one and (2) think about how Tolkien's story could have been different had Gollum required a push. Could it be shown that Sam loved Frodo and Rosie and the Shire so much that he feels compelled to 'save' it? Does Frodo take one for the team and take Gollum down with himself? Does Frodo push and so 'murder' Gollum, and so he then has to deal with that the rest of his life in Aman? I'll give it some thought if anyone's interested.
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What's the difference between an deus ex machinum(a?) and a eucatastrophe, anyway? Or are you implying that there isn't one?
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I'd say a lot. The eagles helping Gandalf save Frodo and Sam are D E M, and not E. Still, that's a late night thought...