[Shelob]

Speaking as an all-powerful mod who witnessed this I must say that I could easily see both sides of the secret message issue...however so far as that went it took everything in my power not to post a general "Are you people CRAZY? Saucepan Man's a WOLF, don't trust him!" Once I got over that reaction I must say I didn't see any need for limiting the use of similar messages. It just didn't seem practical because I could clearly see how they were not a one sided deal.

True, the messages stated that a player was innocent. However the player wasn't. If Sauce hadn't told Nilp he was innocent through the message he may have been more serious suspected. The messages work both ways, they could harm wolves if all the innocents were going around saying "Look at me, I'm not a wolf!" but then again it could just as easily be a message which saves a wolf.


Given that the secret messages are basically just an evolution of the point of the game it seems to me that the bigger, perhaps deeper, issue here is the evolution of this game and it's players. Nilpaurion and Saucepan Man had used similar secret messages before, they could recognize them when they saw them and could then use the messages to influence their play. Others could not. When the WereWolf Junior games started many "senior" players stressed that the games should not be considered "junior" and "senior" but rather simply two sides of the same thing. Certainly no one would argue that all new players must play x-number of WWJ games before moving onto the full Tol-in-Gaurhoth version, just as any experienced player is not restricted from WWJ games.

If we wish to consider the use or restriction of secret messages I think we need to consider the "junior" and "senior" issue again. Ignoring the obvious/not-obvious natures of various secret messages (I caught acrostics all but instatnly but didn't catch anagrams until they were pointed out, simply because acrostics are easier for me and, so far as I'm concerned, more "obvious"), anyway, ignoring that the only way a player will catch the messages is if they're familiar with the previous use of similar messages. Littleman Poet wasn't expecting messages to be passed in such a way because he hadn't seen something like it before and so he was indignent when he learned of it, but would anyone say that he must be restricted to WWJ games because he hasn't got enough expierience? I should hope not.


I will not say that that is the only way to look at this, I will not even say that it is, in truth, even anywhere near the most important way. I simply bring it up because to me if one will argue that "secret messages" are against the spirit of the game one must really question what will and will not be allowed. A game in which no one but gifteds can leave hints will leave the gifteds glaringly obvious. To avoid that a game in which no one can leave hints defeats the purpose, a player would have to spend more time editing their posts to ensure that there is not phrasing or accidental suggestion that they are innocent and wouldn't be able to really focus on finding wolves. And what would you have to work form in such a case anyway, a voting record? Any player who has played at least one game will argue that a voting record tells you very little on it's own, to find wolves one must look not only at the record but also at what everyone has said, if all people can say is "Shelob's vote looks suspicious" you are still working from only the voting record, it's just been dressed up a bit.

I still wish to hear from Littleman Poet, it may be I have misinterrpreted his reasons for not wanting the hinting and if that's the case it may be my argument is not relevent to the issue at hand. However I felt it should be said, what's at stake here isn't "was that cheating?" it's how we wish to see the game played in the future. Go look at the first game, it varies hugely from how games now are played but I don't think anyone would claim that it is wrong. The game has just evolved since then, and it evolves with each new game, each combination of players, and the conclusions we draw from each new Death.

I hope that it either makes sense or helps (preferably both, in reality), but even if it doesn't...