[Raynor]

Originally Posted by Manwe

‘goetia’ is therefore sorcery and necromancy, the summoning and control of spirits; necromancy and the influence of events and physical phenomenon.

This disregards the p.o.v. given in the letter #151:

Galadriel speaks of the 'deceits of the Enemy'. Well enough, but magia could be, was, held good (per se), and goeteia bad. Neither is, in this tale, good or bad (per se), but only by motive or purpose or use... The Enemy's operations are by no means all goetic deceits, but 'magic' that produces real effects in the physical world. But his magia he uses to bulldoze both people and things, and his goeteia to terrify and subjugate.

Therefore, goetheia is a scene play, deceiving (hear hear Sun Tzi) while only magic produces real effects.

The only difference I think therefore is this ‘latent’ distinction given, that ‘magia’ is white magic; used by “good”, and ‘goetia’ for evil purposes and thus used by “evil”.

I disagree again, they are both rather neutral both sides use both, same source:

Neither is, in this tale, good or bad (per se), but only by motive or purpose or use. Both sides use both, but with different motives...Their magia the Elves and Gandalf use (sparingly): a magia, producing real results (like fire in a wet faggot) for specific beneficent purposes. Their goetic effects are entirely artistic and not intended to deceive: they never deceive Elves (but may deceive or bewilder unaware Men) since the difference is to them as clear as the difference to us between fiction, painting, and sculpture, and 'life'.

Radagastly you say that Tolkien was a Catholic, this is true, however there was no hint of religion in LoTR, if there was it was not his intention.

There are two passing refferences in LotR:

Originally Posted by The shadow of the past, ForR

Gandalf crept to one side of the window. Then with a dart he sprang to the sill, and thrust a long arm out and downwards. There was a squawk, and up came Sam Gamgee's curly head hauled by one ear.
- Well, well, bless my beard! said Gandalf. Sam Gamgee is it? Now what may you be doing?
- Lor bless you, Mr. Gandalf, sir! said Sam. Nothing!

Originally Posted by A conspiracy unmasked, FotR

Merry went to the door:
- What about supper and beer in the throat? he called.

Frodo came out drying his hair.
- There's so much water in the air that I'm coming into the kitchen to finish, he said.

-Lawks! said Merry, looking in. The stone floor was swimming.

And more specifically, here is Tolkien's insight:

Originally Posted by Letter #165

The only criticism that annoyed me was one that it 'contained no religion' (and 'no Women', but that does not matter, and is not true anyway). It is a monotheistic world of 'natural theology'. The odd fact that there are no churches, temples, or religious rites and ceremonies, is simply part of the historical climate depicted. It will be sufficiently explained, if (as now seems likely) the Silmarillion and other legends of the First and Second Ages are published. I am in any case myself a Christian; but the 'Third Age' was not a Christian world.

Originally Posted by Letter #156

It is to be presumed that with the reemergence of the lineal priest kings (of whom Luthien the Blessed Elf-maiden was a foremother) the worship of God would be renewed, and His Name (or title) be again more often heard. But there would be no temple of the True God while Numenorean influence lasted.

I am in the agreement with Boromir88 and others who believe that the Mouth of Sauron was higher in rank. Lieutenant of Barad-dur isn’t some fancy foppish title, we have specific textual evidence that he had risen in Sauron’s favour, none so for the Witch King, and thus was of higher rank.
...
Therein lies the answer, he was less powerful than the Mouth of Sauron because of his lack of ambition.

Rising in title does not equal holding the highest rank after Sauron. In the Hunt for the ring, the nazguls are presente as "his mightiest servants", who "were by far the most powerful of his servants". What particular action do we see from the mouthie? He ran with his tail between his legs, in his only piece of action. He is good at administering, perhaps, but only behind friendly lines. The real commanders are the nazgul.

Sauron would have had the Mouth in place of Saruman not the Witch King, who is described in letter #246 being “reduced to impotence” after the War.

I don't see the relevance of this comparison; no one would compare the status of the wikie with anything; he was literally out of the scene after the Pellenor Fields; after that moment, if you compare him to anyone, you can prove anything you like, but it doesn;t have much weight.

I disagree with this point that Men were unable to learn it, and consequently agreeing with Boromir88 that they could. So into the open I throw this idea ‘magic’ is the same or closely related to ‘machinery’.

"The basic motive for magia - quite apart from any philosophic consideration of how it would work - is immediacy: speed, reduction of labour, and reduction also to a minimum (or vanishing point) of the gap in time between the idea or desire and the result or effect." (Letter #155)

I disagree that magic and machinery are the same; let's see the quote again:

Both sides live mainly by 'ordinary' means. The Enemy, or those who have become like him, go in for 'machinery' – with destructive and evil effects — because 'magicians', who have become chiefly concerned to use magia for their own power, would do so (do do so). The basic motive for magia – quite apart from any philosophic consideration of how it would work – is immediacy: speed, reduction of labour, and reduction also to a minimum (or vanishing point) of the gap between the idea or desire and the result or effect. But the magia may not be easy to come by, and at any rate if you have command of abundant slave-labour or machinery (often only the same thing concealed), it may be as quick or quick enough to push mountains over, wreck forests, or build pyramids by such means.

So machinery is a surrogate, not a subspecies, of magic.

Magic was becoming far less important in Middle Earth as the years progressed. The age of his magic is over, this is accepted by Gandalf, Galadriel, and Elrond, and most of their kind, which is why they cross Over the Sea.

The age of magic is over and the age of elves is over... the age of Men begin... Men are said in the letters not to be able to use magic.... if man can use magic and their age begin, but there is no magic, do they actually use magic (as in to generate it)? I believe you are arguing against yourself.