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Old 01-04-2007, 12:07 PM   #15
Child of the 7th Age
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Bęthberry and Boromir - Great comments.

I'd like to throw one more quotation in the pot:

Quote:
But even before this wickedness of Morgoth was suspected the Wise in the Elder Days taught always that the Orcs were not 'made' by Melkor, and therefore were not in their origin evil. They might have become irredeemable (at least by Elves and Men), but they remained within the Law. That is, that though of necessity, being the fingers of the hand of Morgoth, they must be fought with the utmost severity, they must not be dealt with in their own terms of cruelty and treachery. Captives must not be tormented, not even to discover information for the defence of the homes of Elves and Men. If any Orcs surrendered and asked for mercy, they must be granted it, even at a cost. This was the teaching of the Wise, though in the horror of the War it was not always heeded. Morgoth's Ring, HoMe X, 419
This is another fine example of Tolkien answering a question without actually answering it. I love the phrase "might have become irredeemable (at least by Elves and Men)". (Hmm... There is a sneaky hint here that the situation could have been regarded differently in the eyes of the Valar or Eru.)

Still, JRRT was at least willing to consider the possibility that an Orc might plead for mercy. If a orcs had the ability to make such a plea (and why would Tolkien raise the point unless he felt that they had that ability?), I think they might be able to be "redeemed" in some form or fashion.

Actually, what I find most interesting is not what Tolkien said about this subject, but how I feel about this situation. There is something inside me that rebels at the idea that all orcs are unconditionally doomed simply by the mere fact of their existence. What kind of world condemns someone at birth and does not allow for any possibility of change? And how about the original Elves who were captured by Morgoth and tortured into submission so that their very nature was changed. To me, it raises questions about the justness of the world.

OK, I'm going out on a limb here. But is it possible to have a just world, a world where there is a clear demarcation between goodness and evil (at least in theory), if a being is condemned to perdition simply because they happen to be born to a particular station in life? I am willing to accept that 99% of orcs were doomed....but I somehow can't accept that each and every one of them down to the end of time had no chance to be anything but evil.

But maybe I am way too soft-hearted....

P.S. For a definitive answer to this question, drop into the ongoing Rohan RPG "The Fellowship of the Fourth Age". Its main question is similar to that posed by this thread: were any of the orcs of Mordor redeemable after the destruction of the Ring and the demise of Sauron?
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Last edited by Child of the 7th Age; 01-04-2007 at 12:11 PM.
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