I completely agree with
Lal's previous post. Seems that we came to a place where the two of us meet. Only one thing:
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Lalwendë
It makes sense of the fact that evil has been built into the fabric of this world from the very beginning (different to Middle-Eastern originating views of our own world where there was a Fall - there was no Falling to be done in Arda as there was no state of grace to begin with due to Melkor's discordancies...if there was a state of grace it was presumably when there was nothing but Eru, seeing as he says he created everything).
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If I use your terminology, then the Fall in ME happened
before the creation of the world itself. That's just the sole difference, but it actually
happened.
The thought of mine that the Arda was flawed has its roots here:
Quote:
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Here ends the SILMARILLION. If it has passed from the high and the beautiful to darkness and ruin, that was of old the fate of Arda Marred; and if any change shall come and the Marring be amended, Manwë and Varda may know; but they have not revealed it, and it is not declared in the dooms of Mandos.
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Marring of Arda. You are right that there was no "state of grace" for the Creation: but for Ainur, there was - before they played, let's say. I'd compare Melkor's music to the eating of the apple by Adam&Eve. The point is, that the flaws appear with the first beings independant on the Creator's will: someone of them just in time decides to do something which goes against the plans, or let's say, orders put to them by the Creator.
P.S. What was the original question of this forum?
