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Old 02-16-2007, 07:46 PM   #184
littlemanpoet
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Quote:
Originally Posted by davem
Once the story begins Eru plays no part.
This is debatable. There are numerous references in LotR to things that are "meant" to be; by whom? It is never stated baldly that it is Eru, for to do so would do violence to the story the way Tolkien intends to tell it, but the reference is there nonetheless; regardless of whether one agrees that this is Eru, the burden of proof is on those who would argue that it is not Eru.

Quote:
Originally Posted by davem
The one time he intervenes he is a weapon of mass destruction.
To suggest that Eru is a weapon of mass destruction wielded by the Valar doesn't work, for then one is saying that the Valar control Eru, which cannot be. Thus the analogy breaks apart. Eru is more than a mere weapon. Point of fact, this is a derogatory statement that is rather offensive to the theists amongst us.

Quote:
Originally Posted by davem
Eru is only 'necessary' to the story as an explanation of how things originated.
Only if one fails to accept that Eru can be perceived behind the scenes all over the legendarium.

Quote:
Originally Posted by davem
In fact, [Eru] is not necessary to the story at all, & a polytheistic M-e would work just as well.
If this is the case, why does Tolkien insist on keeping Eru in the story? Why does Tolkien redact theism back into the story that has achieved a 'much higher, more mythic' atmosphere? Why is he not satisfied with that which he produced in the 1920's? If one were to posit that anything Tolkien wrote after the 1920's, is unnecessary, what does that remove? Are we sure we would want to live with such a reduction? It is a very dangerous game to play (and rather foolish, frankly), picking a particular period of an author's writing (especially an early period!), and saying, this is the real thing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by davem
Eru is a cypher, playing the part assigned to him & then disappearing till he is needed to drive the plot forward again (though it would not take very much rewriting to get rid of him altogether)
One is left wondering if this is the desire of certain readers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by davem
Eru is the most two dimensional character Tolkien created & the least necessary from a literary perspective.
Highly debatable again. It depends on what a reader is willing to acknowledge is Eru in action, and what is not.

Quote:
Originally Posted by davem
Gets my vote for the most boring & gap filling character Tolkien created.
Some posters sometimes reveal more about themselves than they do about their subject. All in all, this particular post is loaded with unsubstantiated opinion that is debatable at best, uses dangerous and unwise choices in literary analysis, and lacks basis in evidence.
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