Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Folwren
No good person in the books ever killed someone who already had the ring of power. No one ever looked at it and said, "Wow, I really like that Ring, let's kill him for it." The only person who almost did was Boromir, and that was after a long time of struggling with it, and that was also with the knowledge of what it was. Smeagol killed Deagol because Deagol had a pretty gold ring, not because Deagol held a powerful weapon that could defeat Sauron. (Tell me if I'm wrong about there not being anyone else but Boromir, it's really bad practice of me to be in an argument now...I haven't read the books in nearly two years.)
Okay, so if you wish to disregard his cradle stealing, then consider the fact that when he met Bilbo, his soul intention of the riddle game was so that in the end, he could throttle him and eat him. You don't think that's good evidence? And during the riddle game, Gollum is getting hungrier and hungrier and all the while of the riddles, wishes only to kill poor Bilbo. When Bilbo gives him an unanswerable question (unfair, yes, I'm aware of that), Gollum admits defeat, but plans to go, get his precious, and return and kill Bilbo in secret. You don't call that murderous?
|
Firstly, we don't know that Gollum was not already 'good'. The whole point of the Ring is that it is such a powerfully evil thing that it could drive even the best people into extremes such as murder. And what could be more humble than a Hobbit? Maybe we could even say that it is Gollum's very innocence (in terms of him not having the faintest clue what this Ring is, unlike most others who come into contact with it) that drives him to the extreme of murdering for it. I'm sure there's a good discussion been had already on just how the Ring works, and it's worth looking for as that is the crucial matter - the 'criminal' here is not Gollum but The Ring and how it works. But really, Lommy puts it very well here:
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Thinlomien
First, Sméagol didn't attack or kill Déagol because he had some random pretty gold ring. He attcaked because he was overtaken by the lust and the lure of the ring. He maybe had some natural inclination to greed since he acted this quickly, but I daresay he didn't do this because he was a bad/evil person. Greed was his weak point and it proved fatal here. (Also, one must consider that it is possible that the Ring put more "luring power" to Sméagol than to Boromir, but I'm not sure why would it so so or can it control itself that much..)
|
Anyway, both the alleged cradle stealing and his thoughts of eating Bilbo have to be disregarded in a very ethical sense. The former is hearsay (and adds some mighty fine chills to the tale!) and the latter is only 'intention', it is not 'deed'. Had Gollum come to court then only his deeds would be judged, and there is no evidence he ate babies apart from folk tales and no evidence he did eat Bilbo because as we know, Bilbo got away! And even if there was then we would have to stop and think that all of this is down to The Ring. It exerts a truly horrible effect on anyone it touches and Gollum has it for an incredible amount of time.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Folwren
I strongly disagree with you on the Bible subject, but I won't get into it here. The Might's right, and I don't want to lead this anymore off track in such a blatant matter.
|
I agree, this isn't the place! But as you know, if things like that are brought up, people will get their nasty pointy sticks out and prod at them.
