[Legate of Amon Lanc]

Originally Posted by cesar.ewok

And a question: wraith world = spirit world?

Of course.

Originally Posted by Raynor

Hm, I am not completely sure about that:

But the part you quote only means, or at least I take it like that, that Sauron knew there was something strange going on there. It could have been a great Elf lord, or Gandalf who was spying in Mordor. What I meant by sensing was that Sauron would know that there is the Ring. And the only moment he 100% knew it was when Frodo put it on. He didn't know at that point - otherwise, he would have sent all the Nazgul to Cirith Ungol. The same, maybe the Necromancer in Dol Guldur could have sensed some strange power stirring up there, but he couldn't have known if it's Bilbo with the Ring, or Thranduil stirring up all his magic around his stronghold, or Gandalf chasing of an army of spiders by all his power unleashed at once, or whatever else.

Originally Posted by Nerwen

You know, I had always assumed the Ring would make any mortal invisible, but for some reason the full implications never occurred to me.

Would it be necessary to wear it all the time, though?

I believe not. But the person would have it with himself, like Bilbo, all the time - and when e.g. Denethor would have welcomed delegates from Harad, I'm sure he'd put the Ring on and intimidated them to do what he wanted (make peace, retreat their armies behind Poros or whatever).

Originally Posted by CSteefel

Hmm, I am not sure I buy this part, although I agree with the first part of the post. Galadriel asks Sam if he has seen anything of the Ring and Sam replies that he hasn't, and was in fact wondering what she and Frodo were talking about. And there does not seem to be any mention of people noticing the Ring of Fire on the hand of Gandalf, despite encounters over countless years with all manner of beings (Men, Elves, and even the wizard Saruman, who apparently only gradually came to realize that Gandalf was in possession of the Ring of Fire). Why, for example, would somebody like Saruman, who was sensitive to the use of "magic", or at least the powers associated with a ring like that held by Gandalf, not see it immediately??

All of these imply to me that it was possible to keep the Three Rings invisible or at least unnoticed. Of course, their role is different than the role of the One Ring, which is a ring that literally broadcasts power (thus the ability of the Nazgul and even Gollum to sense it), so this perhaps explains in part how it was possible to keep them hidden.

And this is what I am saying. The people simply don't think about them. And what more, the "magic" would be fooling them (at least those with lesser will) so that they won't remember/think of that even if they got an idea about such a thing. Indeed, only someone who really came to one of the bearers with the intention "Now I will go and take a look whether he doesn't have one of the Rings" could spot them. It would have to be real interest, not just simple curiosity. From all the Middle-Earth I believe only Sauron, Saruman and the Ringwraith (or the Mouth), the latter only had they been specially instructed for that by Sauron, could spot the Rings and not be fooled by that "misleading spell". But Saruman was with Elrond and Galadriel probably only during the White Council meetings, let's say once in fifty or hundred years, and he didn't know whether the bearers are Elrond and Galadriel or Glorfindel and Celeborn or someone else in their houses. The more that the Three were taboo and were never spoken of. Cf. when Glóin asks the Elves about the Rings:

Originally Posted by Council of Elrond

"But still there are the Three. What of the Three Rings of the Elves? Very mighty Rings, it is said. Do not the Elf-lords keep them? (..) I see Elf-lords here. Will they not say?"
The Elves returned no answer. (...) Elrond [said] "(...) But of them it is not permitted to speak."

Glóin was not completely stupid. He was now informed about the Rings and he had two of them in the room with him, yet he turns to all the "Elf-lords" in the room. Despite the fact that Elrond was the Master of the House, it was not self-evident that he would be one of the Keepers, as many of us, the outside observes, would think. Even Saruman, during his visit of Rivendell, would have to check all the elves in the house to be sure. Anyway, wouldn't giving the Ring to one of the more "active" elves who ride out to the wilderness, be more useful? (Of course the learned would know that the Three were made for protection and healing, but still.) And concerning Sam, he didn't even expect any Ring in there. He was also probably thinking of Gaffer and the Shire at that time. He didn't even see or hear what Galadriel and Frodo were talking about.

Anyway, this topic would do for many pages and it's very intriguing, but it's not actually the main topic of this thread.