[Sophia the Thunder Mistress]

Wow, I've been out for a while, and have missed some heavy stuff. But Kudos to all on this discussion (while wildly off topic) it's been an excellent read and very thought provoking.

As for a thought of my own. Menelien has a point, and it is a good one, and I think all of you have been rather harsh on her. I'm no relativist, though far from a fundamentalist, but I am able (I think) to see where she's going with it.

That (Ignoring parts of the standard or leaving parts of the standard open for debate will result in chaos and evil) is what I don't agree with. I don't think that they should be, as you put it, "open for debate" in the literal sense, I just think that a man or woman should be able to have a choice. If they choose badly, of course it's a loss, of course that person's life is now not as good as it could be, but the matter of choice is there.

The discussion that never happened about people's opinions being right or wrong as relates to sticky situations (ie, the war in Iraq- though let's not get into that [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img]) was the beginning of all this discussion on moral relativism and it's consequences/implications. There are grey areas, in which it is difficult to know the "moral law" (or as Menelien put it the mental law- of which all people seem to have at least elementary knowledge). In those situations we do have to leave it to the conscience of the individual. I don't think that anywhere Menelien was advocating a moral anarchy of sorts [img]smilies/wink.gif[/img].

But while our actions may not be measurable by human standards, and thus left open to our own interpretation. I maintain that there is still a standard by which they are measured.

Here:

I don't think of it as a good idea to follow certain ideals blindly, no matter what happens.

is where I want to clarify. Following blindly is silly, following tested standards with justification for doing so is only rational. I should hope we all do.

But, in the end, while your choice of standard is genuinely yours, there are bad standards available to be chosen. If I buy an improperly made ruler, I'm not going to measure inches right, no matter how determined I may be to continue using that ruler. And because I think it's measuring standard inches doesn't mean it is. (or centimeters or what have you)

Sophia