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Pitchwife · 01-05-2009, 06:06 PM

One more attempt to turn this back into a Tolkien discussion (and don't think I'm not tempted to join the melee...)

Eru is not the Christian God (however much the Professor may have tried to make him so) but a fictional character based on Tolkien's idea of the Christian God. Proof: Eru did several things which the Christian God (according to the Bible) didn't do: e.g. creating elves as well as men, drowning Numenor, sending Gandalf back after his death (supposing the Valar weren't responsible for that) etc.

An interesting parallel might be Alternate History novels using historical characters. I don't know if any of you are familiar with Orson Scott Card's Alvin Maker series, but to take a (random) example from that, there's a character in it called Taleswapper who is based on the poet William Blake (his real name is actually mentioned). Now while Taleswapper doesn't really do or say anything that would be completely out of character for the real William Blake, he didn't do quite a lot of things the real William Blake did (e.g. writing/engraving Jerusalem and Milton) and vice versa (e.g. emigrating to America when we know the real Blake spent the whole of his life in Britain).

Likewise, although we wouldn't expect Eru to act entirely unlike the Christian God as Tolkien saw Him, it doesn't necessarily follow that every attribute ascribed to God by Christian theology during the last 2000 years is valid for him (with a lower case 'h' !).

EDIT: Oops, I just realized I hadn't read page 2! I was afraid this was turning into another Christians vs non-Christians thread (like 'Lord of the Bible'), but others took care of it before me; sorry! Nevertheless, I stick to my arguments about Eru.

01-05-2009, 06:06 PM	#13
Pitchwife Wight of the Old Forest Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Unattended on the railway station, in the litter at the dancehall Posts: 3,329	One more attempt to turn this back into a Tolkien discussion (and don't think I'm not tempted to join the melee...) Eru is not the Christian God (however much the Professor may have tried to make him so) but a fictional character based on Tolkien's idea of the Christian God. Proof: Eru did several things which the Christian God (according to the Bible) didn't do: e.g. creating elves as well as men, drowning Numenor, sending Gandalf back after his death (supposing the Valar weren't responsible for that) etc. An interesting parallel might be Alternate History novels using historical characters. I don't know if any of you are familiar with Orson Scott Card's Alvin Maker series, but to take a (random) example from that, there's a character in it called Taleswapper who is based on the poet William Blake (his real name is actually mentioned). Now while Taleswapper doesn't really do or say anything that would be completely out of character for the real William Blake, he didn't do quite a lot of things the real William Blake did (e.g. writing/engraving Jerusalem and Milton) and vice versa (e.g. emigrating to America when we know the real Blake spent the whole of his life in Britain). Likewise, although we wouldn't expect Eru to act entirely unlike the Christian God as Tolkien saw Him, it doesn't necessarily follow that every attribute ascribed to God by Christian theology during the last 2000 years is valid for him (with a lower case 'h' !). EDIT: Oops, I just realized I hadn't read page 2! I was afraid this was turning into another Christians vs non-Christians thread (like 'Lord of the Bible'), but others took care of it before me; sorry! Nevertheless, I stick to my arguments about Eru. __________________ Und aus dem Erebos kamen viele seelen herauf der abgeschiedenen toten.- Homer, Odyssey, Canto XI Last edited by Pitchwife; 01-05-2009 at 06:21 PM.