[blantyr]

Originally Posted by Galadriel55

What role does magic play in Middle-earth? - it's just there. It doesn't come out of the blue to help a certain being accomplish something; it's just, erm, not being used at certain times, if you'll forgive this rough terminology.

Sometimes it doesn't hurt to go to the dictionary.

1. the power of apparently influencing the course of events by using mysterious or supernatural forces
2. mysterious tricks, such as making things disappear and appear again, performed as entertainment.
3. a quality that makes something seem removed from everyday life, esp. in a way that gives delight
4. informal something that has such a quality

I think we are talking about the first definition, though Tolkien's works can create the third and fourth in the reading.

The first definition has to be qualified, though, in that those who wield magic in Middle Earth might not consider it mysterious, and would consider it natural. The above definition 1 was written for mundane reality, where any magic that might exist is mysterious or supernatural. It applies well enough to Earth, more awkwardly to Middle Earth.

There is a trite phrase 'mind over matter' which might be applied. One might say magic is use of the mind to sense or manipulate matter without use of the body's tools of hands, muscle and the like, or to extend the senses beyond normal.

I have great faith in everyone's ability to nitpick the above. For example, by this definition a magnifying glass might extend the senses and thus fit the description of magical. However, that's a start.

Originally Posted by Galadriel55

Is it the object or the person that has the magic? - I'd say both. However, some objects could be said to be simply advanced technology, things refined by deep knowledge and superb skill of the maker.

We have already mentioned cases where the magic seems clearly in the object... the west gate of Moria and the palantír. Still, even then, an outsider directs and activates the magic, through a word in the case of the gate, or by gazing into the palantír. The phial of Galadriel might be another example of an item with specific purpose that might be triggered by an individual with no special talents or abilities.

In principle, one might then say that much other magic comes from the individual. Maybe so, but...

Originally Posted by Galadriel55

The Rings of Power confuse me. They require all three things above: the magic (or should I say inner power/will/abilities?) of the wielder, great skill, and their own magic.

Many of the examples of magic are centered on Gandalf. He wields not only a ring, but also a staff. I interpret both Gandalf's ring and staff as very general purpose tools that focus, shape, amplify (or choose another word) the 'inner power/will/abilities' of their wielder. As such, a staff or ring might be considered different from the gate or palantír. Anyone speaking the correct word might open the gate. Even a hobbit could trigger operation of a palantír.

How many examples do we have of magic without an amplifying artifact? Aragorn can heal with athelas. Is the power in Aragorn, in the athelas, or both? Does Aragorn amplify the athelas or does athelas amplify Aragorn?

I can recall Aragorn making three prophecies, that Theoden would return to Edoras, that Gandalf should beware Moria, and that he and Eomer would draw swords together after they parted after Helm's Deep. While Aragorn was carrying Andúril while he made all three prophecies, I have no real reason to think there was any item amplifying his ability to prophecy.

I'd be interested if people could give a few other examples of magic being wielded by individuals with no amplifying devices such as a ring, staff or leaf. I'd like to think magic can be used without such props. Finding examples is a problem, though.

Many of the items mentioned above such as the gate, staffs, rings, phial and palantír were presumably created by someone or other. All such making takes place off stage. The impression I have is that some of the "inner power/will/abilities" of the creator of an item is pushed into the item. Someone might want to say a bit more about that.

I will add that to this point we have been focused primarily on the sort of magic that a wizard or elf lord might wield. There are other things happening. We might think of the oath sworn to Isildur at Erech, and his curse upon the oath breakers. We might ask if Aragorn, whose life was entangled in prophecy, had a fate or destiny that was supported by some form of magic. We might ask if speaking the name of a valar amplifies an oath, or might become something akin to prayer. We might talk of Beorn and other shape shifters. If we've mentioned Aragorn's healing and prophecy, what other people who are not elf lords, wizards or Nazgûl might have other similar abilities? Eowyn in slaying a fell beast also seemingly changed the weather. What is it that brought snow to Caradhras, or covered the land with darkness during the War of the Ring? Should we speak of that flock of crows that might have been looking for the Fellowship as they went south from Rivendell?

There is a good deal magic in the books. We might not want to focus too narrowly.