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Old 03-21-2012, 04:19 PM   #9
Legate of Amon Lanc
A Voice That Gainsayeth
 
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Legate of Amon Lanc is spying on the Black Gate.Legate of Amon Lanc is spying on the Black Gate.Legate of Amon Lanc is spying on the Black Gate.Legate of Amon Lanc is spying on the Black Gate.Legate of Amon Lanc is spying on the Black Gate.Legate of Amon Lanc is spying on the Black Gate.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Inziladun View Post
I therefore take Melkor's special connection with Manwë to mean that they came into being at the same time; the first creations of Ilúvatar. That would in no way conflict with the statements regarding Melkor being the most powerful of the Valar.
I don't believe that. First, of course, I am rather convinced the term "first creations of Ilúvatar" cannot be understood in the temporal sense: as in, they were created as the first two. If for nothing else, then because the time itself did not exist back then yet (Timeless halls and all that prove that point, I'd say). I always thought the Ainur came into being more or less "at the same time", if you can use that expression.

And even if you can't - well, we are speaking about transcendental things here which cannot be spoken about in our terms, only metaphorically (because how can you speak about something that was before existence, right? Not to speak of, "before" time..). So even if Manwë and Melkor were the first creations of Ilúvatar and "came to being before all the others" (speaking metaphorically) - now what does it mean? It all comes down to that they share some priority, which is not temporal, but in their, well, power. Potential. Abilities. Call it whatever you will. And we are then back again at what I have been talking about... they simply do have equal potential.
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