Quote:
Originally Posted by cellurdur
I think there are three main points I need to address. The first is my personal way of trying to decipher what Tolkien left us. I put much more weight on Christopher Tolkien's words than some do. However, these are how I tend to come my conclusions.
1. Works published by JRR Tolkien.
2. Works published by Christopher Tolkien
3. The latest workable notes that don't contradict 1 or 2.
Christopher Tolkien knew his father and his father's works infinitely better than any of us can ever hope to do. Knowing his father he said this about his father's desire to stick with things he himself had published.
When discussing the descent of Celebrimbor, he wrote this about a late note placing him as a Teleri.
"no doubt he had forgotten that theory had appeared in print, for had he remembered it he would have undoubtedly have felt bound by it."-HOME XII 'Of Dwarves and Men
|
I don't feel one has to know Tolkien at all to think that he would probably abide by the story in print. Even if he 'wouldn't' I think he should, as 'in print' concerns the art of subcreation. He didn't all the time, but to my mind the
general concern is consistency with already published description, so as to not undermine the Subcreated World.
I often give great weight to Christopher Tolkien's opinion too, but HME clearly illustrates that he did not know very many things, despite his relationship with both his father and his father's works. And with respect to what Christopher Tolkien published
as a story -- I mean he published HME and UT as well -- I see no indication that these versions were intended as 'canon', or as any ultimate statement that they represent what Tolkien desired.
For example Christopher Tolkien knew the Helm of Hador was intended to have more 'ink' and presence in the Narn, but I think it's fairly clear that he chose not to write it in because there simply wasn't enough Tolkien-written text to employ -- enough for the amount CJRT desired anyway.
Is that a reason to accept that Turin wore a Dwarf-mask when facing Glaurung, over the Helm, because JRRT didn't get around to writing 'enough' about the Helm for Christopher Tolkien to feel he could easily incorporate the idea [by trying to be more editor than 'writer' I would say]? Not for me anyway. Or do you have an alternative theory about why CJRT chose the Dwarf-mask for the constructed Narn?
I don't think it is in Christopher Tolkien's character to stamp these versions as anything that should outweigh his father's actual texts, and I don't think that's the point in constructing them. He certainly was given authority by Tolkien to edit and publish, but that isn't the same as claiming the one volume versions should have authority over his father's work.
Quote:
|
Christopher Tolkien himself says it is impossible to have a definitive version of his fathers legendarium, but I give more credence to something he has published unless he explicitly states it to be a mistake.
|
Of course it is impossible, but 'mistakes' by whom? And since it was impossible to incorporate every last known idea into a one volume 'consistent' version, is it a 'mistake' not to include the longer history of the Helm of Hador for example? Or not to alter Sador -- as Tolkien intended to change this character notably, into one of the Druedain if I recall correctly. Certainly not mistakes in my opinion.
Christopher Tolkien has never, to my knowledge, pretended to be or desired to be the creator of Middle-earth, but rather he desired to provide
a version of these tales for readers. That is, he could at least give readers the intended 'format' or experience, if not his father's ultimate version. And then he showed us the texts behind his constructions, in HME, with a very different, more scholarly presentation of the material he had to work with.
In any case, the matter is still not simple, which was my point. You can give your opinions on 'canon' and why you put the constructed Narn and L&C above other texts, and others will take a different approach.
So still more complicated than taking L&C alone as a given, which was my point
