View Single Post
Old 06-19-2013, 03:10 PM   #94
Roy Tmofl
Newly Deceased
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 4
Roy Tmofl has just left Hobbiton.
If I may beat a dead horse.

Can humans use magic without it being devilry or the craft of the enemy? I mean there are virtually no accounts of humans using magic without it being related to evil.

Such as the ring wraiths some of whom were great sorcerers in their time.

Those who used the Nine Rings became mighty in their day, kings, sorcerers, and warriors of old. They obtained glory and great wealth, yet it turned to their undoing. They had, as it seemed, unending life, yet life became unendurable to them. They could walk, if they would, unseen by all eyes in this world beneath the sun, and they could see things in worlds invisible to mortal men; but too often they beheld only the phantoms and delusions of Sauron. And one by one, sooner or later, according to their native strength and to the good or evil of their wills in the beginning, they fell under the thraldom of the ring that they bore and of the domination of the One which was Sauron's. And they became forever invisible save to him that wore the Ruling Ring, and they entered into the realm of shadows. The Nazgűl were they, the Ringwraiths, the Úlairi, the Enemy's most terrible servants; darkness went with them, and they cried with the voices of death. — The Silmarillion, "Of the Rings of Power and the Third Age", 346

Now it seems to me that the ring wraiths when still human used their sorcerery for good "in their day."

I also remember something about the Numenorians being able to speak with animals such as birds and what not. But then again that may fall under the category of being close to nature due to their similarity to the Noldor.

Another example is of course the mouth of Sauron but that doesn't help me support a case for good sorcerery.

The only other example I ca think of is when Aragorn calmed the horse with what someone dubbed elf magic in the extended eddition of the lord of the rings. Now I realize that as probably incorrect as that was most likely either his Dunedain abilities or perhaps an ability gained from living with the elves. If it was does that mean that humans can gain the abilites of the elves?

Well then again another bit of "Magic" might be the enchanting of the blade Narsil later turned Andural but that was the work of the elves. Does anyone know if Narsil was forged by the Numenorians?

However whie I may make the argument that humas have the potential to learn perhaps elven magic and use sorcerery for good. I think it may be possible that Tolkien had all forms of sorcrery used by humans almost always go bad for a reason.

Being that really the only beings who use good magic are pretty much only divine such as Mair or half Mair in the case of Luthien and the Valar which may have been their natural powers which could also explain the elves abilities being simply natural to them or the dwarves (of yore who made mighty spells while hammers fell like ringing bells, perhaps talking of their natural ability to enchant items?)

Well anyway. It might certainly might not but also certainly might be thought that Sorcerery is unatural as it doesn't come from the weilder of it, and being that this story is heavily influenced by Roman Catholisism Tolkien may have been trying to perhaps stress the natural evil tendincies of such things as Sorcerery that humans used and perhaps even names such magic witchcraft and devilry at times.

While stressing the goodness of such things as divine power and natural abilities grnted by said divine power.

I'm sorry once again if I'm just beating a dead horse but what do you think?
Roy Tmofl is offline   Reply With Quote