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Old 08-19-2003, 09:18 AM   #26
Findegil
King's Writer
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
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Sting

When I worked out some changes for the "Revised Fall of Gondolin pt.4" - thread, I was faced by the fact that the replacement of "serpents of iron" to "machines of iron" does not work very well. For me at least it sounds to explicit to be repeated in any occasion.
I searched for a better word than machines but the only one a can offer is "creations" and that is also not very handsome.
For that reason I would like to suggest, that we work out the changes mostly in the debated passage were the "monsters" are created and try to minimise the changes in the further text.
So lets try again:
FG-D-01a Deleting from Maeglin's advice to Morgoth.
Quote:
From the greatness of his wealth of metals and his powers of fire he bid him make {beasts}[machines] like snakes and [streams of fire like ]dragons of irresistible might that should overcreep the Encircling Hills and lap that plain and its fair city in flame and death.
I did again split the references, to make them more understandable. But I would be pleased to read the thoughts of some members at least about this.

FG-D-02c Devising of the dragons.
Quote:
Yet these years are filled by M[orgoth] in the utmost ferment of labour, and all the thrall-folk of the Noldo[r] must dig unceasingly for metals while M[orgoth] sitteth and deviseth fires and calleth flames and smokes to come from the lower heats, nor does he suffer any of the Noldo[r] to stray ever a foot from their place of bondage. Then on a time M[orgoth] assembled all his most cunning smiths{ and sorcerers}, and of iron {and flame} they wrought a {host of monsters}[mass of machines] such as have only at that time been seen and shall not again be till the Great End. {Some}[They] were all of iron so cunningly linked that they might flow like slow rivers of metal or coil themselves around and above all obstacles before them, [and they looked like serpents of iron ]and {those} were filled in their innermost depths with the grimmest of Or[k]s with scimitars and spears[. And the Dragons with scales like]{; others of} bronze and copper[, with their]{ were given} hearts and spirits of blazing fire, [were mustered to]{and they} blast{ed} all that stood before them with the terror of their snorting or trample{d} whatso escaped the ardour of their breath{;}[. Morgoth and his sorcerers wrought] yet other{s were} creatures of pure flame that writhed like ropes of molten metal[ or streams of fire], and they brought to ruin whatever fabric they came nigh, and iron and stone melted before them and became as water, and {upon}[with] them {rode}[moved] the Balrogs {in hundreds}; and these were the most dire of all those {monsters}[creations] which M[orgoth] devised against Gondolin.
I put in the "serpents of iron" and the "streams of fire". If these were once established as names for that "monsters"/"creations", they can be used in the further text, so that the "serpents of iron" which are very often found in the text can stand and only the "dragons of fire" should be changed to "streams of fire".

FG-D-03a Description of the enemies.
Quote:
... and go naked into the open against enemies of steel and fire, whose trampling shakes the earth ...
Even when we remove the mechanical monsters, the description of the enemy of one "of steel and fire" is fitting to such battle and siege in an age of sword and bow.

FG-D-04a
Quote:
… but the stoutest were in dread seeing those {dragons}[streams] of fire and those serpents of {bronze and }iron …
Dragons (of bronze colour) were seen by the inhabitants of Gondolin in the Nirneach Arnoediad at least. So I retained the "monsters"/"creations" that were an expected.

FG-D-05a Flexible dragons pressed into service.
Quote:
But now Gothmog lord of Balrogs, captain of the hosts of {Melko} [Morgoth], took counsel and gathered all his things of iron that could coil themselves around and above all obstacles before them.
Here now things of iron can stand very well, if they are mechanical devises.

FG-D-06a Hollowness of the iron beasts.
Quote:
Then the engines and the catapults of the king poured darts and boulders and molten metals on those ruthless {beasts}[things], and their hollow bellies clanged beneath the buffeting, yet it availed not for they might not be broken, and the fires rolled off them. Then were the topmost opened about their middles, and an innumerable host of the {Orcs} [Orks], the goblins of hatred, poured therefrom into the breach; …
Here beasts is no longer fitting, even if they are later called serpents. The rest of the changes that were suggested are now not necessary.

FG-D-07a The great-footed dragons prepare to attack Gondolin.
Quote:
Now then the plan that they made was to hold what they had won, while those serpents of bronze [colour] and with great feet for trampling climbed slowly over those [serpents] of iron, and reaching the walls there opened a breach wherethrough the Balrogs might {ride upon} [come with] the {dragons}[streams] of [pure ]flame: yet they knew this must be done with speed, for the heats of those {drakes}[creatures] lasted not for ever, and might only be plenished from the wells of fire that Melko had made in the fastness of his own land.
The addition of "pure" in the description of the type 3 monsters, was done for clarity, Since Balrogs are always seen as connected to flames, "streams of flame" might be misunderstood here that . But I am not sure if it is necessary or did the job well. Please make some comments on it.

FG-D-08a Breaking of the Walls.
Quote:
… one of those brazen [coloured] snakes heaves against …
I think the colour is the best way to build the connection Lindil desired for that sentence.

FG-D-09a Imprisonment of the Noldor.
Quote:
... they bound and led back and flung in the iron chambers amid the {dragons}[serpents] of iron, that they might drag them afterward to be thralls of {Melko} [Morgoth].
FG-D-10a At the gate.
Quote:
Fire-drakes are about it and {monsters}[serpents] of iron fare in and out of its gates, …
FG-B-02c Balrogs shoot arrows of fire.
Quote:
... yet a worse matter was it that {a company} [some] of those demons climbed upon the coils of the serpents of iron and thence loosed unceasingly from their bows and slings till a fire began to burn in the city to the back of the main army of the defenders.
This passage is the one I had changed in the other thread to machines. But that sounded very strange. Since we now have established the name "serpents of Iron" for these machines we can let it stand here and in the previous and following quotes.

FG-B-03d Rog's men attack
Quote:
... but the men of Rog leapt even upon the coils of the serpents[ of Iron] and came at those Balrogs and smote them grievously, for all they had whips of flame and claws of steel, and were in stature very great. They battered them[ with their clubs] into {nought} [retreat], or catching at their whips [and] wield[ing] these against them, that they tore {them} [their skin] even as they had aforetime torn the {Gnomes} [Noldor]; and [that ]the {number of}Balrogs {that prished}[were defeated] was a marvel and dread to the hosts of Morgoth[.]{, for ere that day never had any of the Balrogs been slain by the hand of Elves or Men.}
Then Gothmog Lord of Balrogs gathers all his demons [and troops] that were about the city and ordered them thus: a number made for the folk of the Hammer and gave before them, but the greater company rushing upon the flank contrived to get to their backs, higher upon the coils of the {drakes}[serpents] and nearer to the gates, so that Rog might not win back save with great slaughter among his folk.
I didn't like "monsters" since that would mean Rog was fought down only by "demons and monsters". Demons refers normally to Balrogs and monsters to dragons. Since only a couple of Balrogs is left to us that would mean nearly only dragons would fight against Rog. Could we imaging a "greater company [of dragons] rushing upon the flank contrived to get to their backs, higher upon the coils of the {drakes}[serpents] and nearer to the gates"? I can't so what we need is some kind of normal infantry. That normally are Orks, but I wanted to be more ambiguous here.

FG-B-03.05a
Quote:
Then that house of the Hammer fared about smiting and hewing the astonied bands of Morgoth till they were hemmed at the last by an overwhelming force of the Orcs{ and the Balrogs}, and a fire-drake was loosed upon them.
I would rather delete the Balrogs completely. What is a single Balrog when they have a moment ago defeated some Balrogs that were firing arrows? But that shouldn't be the theme here. I included that quote because of the "fire-drake". When taken strictly my theory would interpret the fire-drake as type 3 monster, but I am inclined to change it to a normal fire-drake which would be a type 2 monster without any change to the text here.

Here I will stop for the moment. I think that most of the occasions were type 1 monsters are mentioned were covered in this post. But when I remember rightly during the fight in the city the type 3 monsters are several times mentioned as dragons. Since as yet these type 3 monsters were changed to fire dragons there was no change necessary. But when these type 3 monsters are now "streams of fire" some changes must be introduced. As with FG-B-03.05a it will often be the case that we have to discuss if we want to stick to the theory and change the text or shift the dragons from type 3 to type 2 monsters without any change in the text.

I hope to work on these further but I can't make an promise.
Respectfully
Findegil
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