[The Saucepan Man]

So I figure, let's just toss it out and focus on other aspects of the debate

Woah! Hang on a moment. Sorry to bang on about this, but I think that it is pretty vital to the question of interpreting JRRT’s works.

JRRT, in describing the Arkenstone, tells us that it was cut and fashioned by Dwarves. This is not another character relating to Bilbo the history of the Stone. Nor is it a product of any assumption made by Bilbo. It is JRRT’s description, plain and simple. On that basis, can it really be legitimate to dismiss this description as one which cannot be regarded as accurate because the truth or otherwise of it is lost in the mists of time? Phantom, you rely on the explanation originally given by Gwaihir:

And that had happened so long ago, many lives of Men. The shrouding of time and myth, and the thinking of common sense, says that the dwarves were the ones who fashioned it; so that’s what was believed.

Surely this is something that can be said about many of the events described by JRRT in his writings. If we can say in this case: “Well this is just an old myth and not necessarily true”, why can we not apply the same reasoning in other cases? Why should it be restricted just to the Hobbit? Why should we not be free to apply it to LotR too? And the Silmarillion ...

It just seems to me that, if one were free to dismiss a description of an item given by JRRT in one of his published works on this basis, then one would be free to dismiss a good many other things in the published works besides. And there is no knowing where that might end.

I, too, don't believe that the text about the arkenstone's creation can be taken as concrete, which means it can't be used to refute or support an arguement. It would merely be speculation (which much of this theory is, of course).

I am not sure how it can be regarded as speculative relying on a statement that is there in one of JRRT's published works. Personally, if JRRT tells us that the Arkenstone was cut and fashioned by Dwarves, then I am willing to believe that it was cut and fashioned by Dwarves and not created by Feanor.

Btw, Sophia, I would think that cutting and fashioning a Gemstone would involve more than simply cleaning the detritus off it. It suggests influencing the shape and characteristics of the Stone itself.