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FailBeast · 04-09-2012, 02:59 PM

I saw this thread before and was thinking about it when I watched the movies last, and I think the way they portrayed Elrond made quite a bit of difference on Aragorn and on the nature of the kingship of Gondor.

This Elrond, it seemed like, has little to no regard for men as a race, and he talks bitterly about Isildur in particular. He almost speaks as if the whole mess was Isildur's fault, which seems slightly unfair. The movies give no reason to believe Isildur was a bad guy or bad king. He screwed up once, an Elrond hasn't forgiven him in however many generations.

So, okay, he's a bitter old grouch. But I think, if you think about the fact that he was raising Isildur's heir, you might attribute the changes in Aragorn's character to Elrond's bad attitude. Movie-Aragorn doubts himself. He doesn't really want the kingdom. He doesn't want to reveal himself as Isildur's heir, or even as anybody except some guy when he first mets Boromir. Book Aragorn was much surer of himself and his claim, and is quick to step up and say, "Sword that was broken? Right here. Check this out!" Couldn't being raised by somebody who hates and doubts your race and your ancestor be just the thing to make that difference?

I also thought it was interesting that Elrond in the movie keeps the shards of Narsil, where in the book it clearly belonged to Aragorn. Later on, when Aragorn goes into the paths of the dead, it's that sword that proves his claim to the throne. So, if Elrond has the sword, doesn't that in some sense give him some power to approve or deny a claim to the throne? It may not be desicive; Gondor may choose to accept a king without the sword as proof of his heritage. Oh - except that they'd have been mostly dead, if the Oath-Breakers hadn't showed up with Aragorn because of the sword. I think it's an interesting, and kind of unpleasant, implication if the crown is not awarded based on the individual's character and claim, but because some guy over in Imladris has decided, "Okay, okay, Arwen! Fine! Your boyfriend can have the sword already!"

Interesting choices.

04-09-2012, 02:59 PM	#23
FailBeast Newly Deceased Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 2	Elrond in PJ's LotR I saw this thread before and was thinking about it when I watched the movies last, and I think the way they portrayed Elrond made quite a bit of difference on Aragorn and on the nature of the kingship of Gondor. This Elrond, it seemed like, has little to no regard for men as a race, and he talks bitterly about Isildur in particular. He almost speaks as if the whole mess was Isildur's fault, which seems slightly unfair. The movies give no reason to believe Isildur was a bad guy or bad king. He screwed up once, an Elrond hasn't forgiven him in however many generations. So, okay, he's a bitter old grouch. But I think, if you think about the fact that he was raising Isildur's heir, you might attribute the changes in Aragorn's character to Elrond's bad attitude. Movie-Aragorn doubts himself. He doesn't really want the kingdom. He doesn't want to reveal himself as Isildur's heir, or even as anybody except some guy when he first mets Boromir. Book Aragorn was much surer of himself and his claim, and is quick to step up and say, "Sword that was broken? Right here. Check this out!" Couldn't being raised by somebody who hates and doubts your race and your ancestor be just the thing to make that difference? I also thought it was interesting that Elrond in the movie keeps the shards of Narsil, where in the book it clearly belonged to Aragorn. Later on, when Aragorn goes into the paths of the dead, it's that sword that proves his claim to the throne. So, if Elrond has the sword, doesn't that in some sense give him some power to approve or deny a claim to the throne? It may not be desicive; Gondor may choose to accept a king without the sword as proof of his heritage. Oh - except that they'd have been mostly dead, if the Oath-Breakers hadn't showed up with Aragorn because of the sword. I think it's an interesting, and kind of unpleasant, implication if the crown is not awarded based on the individual's character and claim, but because some guy over in Imladris has decided, "Okay, okay, Arwen! Fine! Your boyfriend can have the sword already!" Interesting choices.