View Single Post
Old 09-23-2015, 10:46 AM   #13
King's Writer
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 1,443
Findegil is a guest of Tom Bombadil.
Okay, I discovered a mistake of mine: Starting with CE-EX-73 I expanded a part of the LQ that was deliberately a summary of events told later in a much fuller account. The summary is given at this place to complete lingustical account (that is original in LQ) of the names of the Elvish groups. The next chapter 6 Of Eldamar and the Princes of the Eldali begins with the Vanyar and Noldor reaching the shore of Beleriand. Therefore here is only the palce for linguistic information to be added and not for expansion the story telling. I worked through the text again keeping that in mind and give it here starting with last paragraph before the changes begin. This paragraph is from an addition coming from Q&E:
These names were however later replaced among the Sindar by the name 'Green-elves', at least as far as the inhabitants of Ossiriand were concerned; for they withdrew themselves and took as little part in the strife with {Morgoth}[Melkor] as they could. This name, S Laegel, pl. Laegil, class-plural Laegrim or Laegel(d)rim, was given both because of the greenness of the land of Lindon, and because the Laegrim clothed themselves in green as an aid to secrecy. This term the oldor translated into Quenya Laiquendi; but it was not much used.>
30 Others there were also of the Teleri that remained in Middle-earth. These were the Elves of Beleriand in the west of the Northern lands. They came from the host of Elw the Grey. He was lost in the woods and many of his folk sought him long in vain; and thus when their kindred departed over Sea they were left behind and went not into the West. Therefore they are called the Sindar, the Grey Elves, but themselves they named {Eglath}[ Egladrim], the Forsaken. CE-EX-75 <Q&E Less commonly the form Sindel, pl. Sindeldi, is also met in Exilic Quenya.> Elw after became their king, mightiest of all the {Alamanyar [correction to }Umanyar{ missed]}. He it was who was called Thingol in the language of Doriath. CE-EX-76 <Q&E Sindar{
Less commonly the form Sindel, pl. Sindeldi, is also met in Exilic Quenya. This} was the name given by the Exiled oldor [footnote: Lake Mithrim, meaning originally 'Lake of the Mithrim'. Mithrim was a name given to them by the southern-dwellers, because of the cooler climate and greyer skies, and the mists of the North. It was probably because the Noldor first came into contact with this northerly branch that they gave in Quenya the name Sindar or Sindeldi 'Grey-elves' to all the Telerin inhabitants of the Westlands who spoke the Sindarin language.
Though this name was also later held ...
This art was later used even in the southern lands ...
The Loremasters also supposed that reference was ... For which reason the Sindar often called them Lachend, pl. Lechind 'flame-eyed'.>
CE-EX-76.1 <Q&E The Sindar had no general name for themselves as distinct from other varieties of Elf, until other kinds entered Beleriand. ...
The old clan-name *Lindai survived in the compound Glinnel, pl. Glinnil, a word only known in historical lore, and the equivalent of Quenya Teleri or Lindar CE-EX-76.2{; see the Notes on the Clan-names below}. All the Sindarin subjects of King Elu-Thingol, as distinguished from the incoming Noldor, ...
While the Noldor were still distinct, ...
Odhil thus became specially the name of the Exiled Noldor.
In this sense the form Godhel, pl. Godhil soon replaced the older form. ... The name was, moreover, chiefly used by those who wished to mark the difference between the Noldor and the Sindar, and to ignore the dwelling of the Noldor in Aman which might give them a claim to superiority. CE-EX-76.3{This was especially the case in Doriath, where King Thingol was hostile to the Noldorin chieftains, Feanor and his sons, and Fingolfin, because of their assault upon the Teleri in Aman, the people of his brother Olw. }The Noldor, therefore, when using Sindarin, never applied this name (Golodh) to themselves, and it fell out of use among those friendly to them.
CE-EX-76.4{4. }The name Eglan, pl. Eglain, Egladrim{. This name}, 'the Forsaken', was, as has been said, given by the Sindar to themselves. ... But they acknowledged the high-kingship of Thingol, and Crdan never took the title of king.>[Footnote: Other names in song and tale are given to these peoples. The Vanyar are the Blessed Elves, and the Spear-elves, the Elves of the Air, the friends of the {Gods}[Valar], the Holy Elves and the Immortal, and the Children of Ingw; they are the Fair Folk and the White.
The Noldor are the Wise, and the Golden, the Valiant, the Sword-elves, the Elves of the Earth, the Foes of Melkor, the Skilled of Hand, the Jewel-wrights, the Companions of Men, the Followers of Finw.
The Teleri are the Foam-riders, the Singers of the Shore, the Free, and the Swift, and the Arrow-elves; they are the Elves of the Sea, the Ship-wrights, the Swanherds, the Gatherers of Pearl, the Blue Elves, the people of Olw. The Nandor are CE-EX-77{the Host of Dn, }the Wood-elves, the Wanderers, the Axe-elves, the Green Elves and the Brown, the Hidden People; and those that came at last to Ossiriand are the Elves of the Seven Rivers, the Singers Unseen, the Kingless, the Weaponless, and the Lost Folk, for they are now no more. The Sindar are the Lemberi, the Lingerers; they are the Friends of Oss, the Elves of the Twilight, the Silvern, the Enchanters, the Wards of Melian, the Kindred of Luthien, the people of Elw. Quoth Pengolod.]>
Here my comments on this new situation:
CE-EX-73 (with CE-SL-22) This Story is told in the next chapter. If the AAm has to be inserted there must be discussed when we edit that chapter.
CE-EX-74 Same is true for this material from [/b]LT[/b].
Accordingly 30 of the original LQ is restored.
CE-EX-75 and -76: These are unchanged from the last version.
CE-EX-76.1: This is a long addition from Q&E. It includes some farther information about the Sindar an general but also adds names in Sindarin for the Noldor and the devision of the Sindar themselves.
CE-EX-76.2: The reference was from one part of Q&E to an other, but due to my editing they are now very close together.
CE-EX-76.3: I removed this spoiler. The enmity between Thingol and the Feanorians should not be fortold.
CE-EX-76.4: Here I removed the structure of the Q&E text.
The last 3 paragraphs about the Crdans folk I would rather use in chapter 6 Of Eldamar and the Princes of the Eldali were also the essay Crdan is used.
Findegil is offline   Reply With Quote