Thread: Is Eru God?
View Single Post
Old 11-29-2005, 09:04 AM   #183
davem
Illustrious Ulair
 
davem's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: In the home of lost causes, and forsaken beliefs, and unpopular names,and impossible loyalties
Posts: 4,240
davem is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.davem is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
My statements were based on Hutton's talk at Birmingham, but I think he got it right.

Quote:
This is true of the Lost Tales, but we ought to note that by '37 Quenta Silmarillion (i.e. immediately pre-LotR) these elements were gone (save marriage, which of course persisted into the final versions). Most importantly, the Valar had already become more thoroughly good or 'Angelic'.
The Quenta is very much a 'transitional' phase - if seen in the context of Tolkien's life. Some aspects of the story had been changed, some elements of the Lost Tales remained. I will look into the details further (don't have my books with me), but, as Hutton points out overall the Legendarium is generally a 'neo-Platonic work, rather than an orthodox Catholic one. I'm not sure Tolkien saw the Quenta as necessarily superceeding the LT, or that he had rejected everything it contained.

Quote:
Where do you see an increase in the role assigned to Eru in the later Silmarillion? I agree that the work at this point was more religious, and of course there is the 'Athrabeth'. But Eru's role in the Silmarillion proper seems to me to be almost identical to his earlier role.
Ok, but I certainly think its clear that Eru's role increased in Tolkien's mind - one only has to read the Letters. His focus increasingly is on Eru's role, the part he plays 'in the wings'. Tolkien wants to explain why what happened was Eru's will. I certainly think the presence of Eru runs through the post LotR Sil in a way that it doesn't in the Quenta.

I think it is clear that pre- LotR Tolkien was less concerned with the Legendarium being 'Orthodox' - because he'd never been challenged on that matter. Only in teh post-LotR period did that concern grow almost to the point of obsession. Changes made to the Legendarium to produce the Quenta were for artistic rather than theological reasons.
davem is offline   Reply With Quote