View Single Post
Old 01-23-2007, 01:06 PM   #129
davem
Illustrious Ulair
 
davem's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: In the home of lost causes, and forsaken beliefs, and unpopular names,and impossible loyalties
Posts: 4,240
davem is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.davem is battling Black Riders on Weathertop.
The problem of Eru.

And it is. Is M-e monotheistic or polytheistic? It can't be both. the simple answer is that it is monotheistic - except Eru doesn't do very much after Ainulindule, & the world is effectively ruled by the Valar. So for 99% of the Sil we have a polytheistic world. In fact, in the early versions the Valar are called Gods, marry & have children. Until the invention of the Second Age & Eru's intervention in the destruction of Numenor Eru plays no part in the tale. And the point is he might as well not have existed. Even in the destruction of Numenor he is not necessary - the Valar could have destroyed the Numenorean fleet. The intervention is equivalent to Tom coming to the Barrow & instead of dealing with the Wight himself shouting for his dad to come & sort it out. Dad appears, a larger & more powerful version of Tom himself, capering & spouting poetry, & totals the Wight (along with half the Old Forest & most of Bree).

In short, we don't need Eru as part of the story. If Ainulindale had begun 'There were the Singers, & they sang The Great Song which brought the worlds into being...' the effect on the story would have been negligible.

Eru is a character who Tolkien attempts to make use of, & he is never more than a plot device. He can't be used without devastating effect, so he is hardly used at all & when he is used he replaces the Valar.

This is why attempts to analyse Eru's motives & character always fail. He propounds the themes or the Music, gives life to the Dwarves & the Children, destroys Numenor & that's basically it. We are not told anything about his personality because he doesn't actually have one & could, as I said, have been entirely replaced by the Valar without any loss to the Secondary World.

This is why I say one cannot rationalise the behaviour of Eru & make it good - though one can attribute all kinds of things to him, in order to make him 'good', but if one takes what Tolkien actually gives us, we have almost nothing to build on. It may be true that
Quote:
Man, whatever the extent of his works, ultimately IS pathetic next to the glory of God.
But we are not talking (at least I'm not) about God, but about the character Eru. I can't think of any point at which Eru displays compassion, mercy, tolerance. He rarely displays wisdom ('Of course you can enter into Arda, Melkor!')

What he does display is pride, lack of compassion & brute force. In the end, as I say, he is no more than a plot device, & an unnecessary one at that.

The Numenor story as 'allegorical'? Interesting. 'Elendil' contains the Elvish word for Star, 'Anarion' Sun & 'Isildur' Moon, so it containing all the elements of an allegory, a creation myth. Star, Sun & Moon gods come to the Earth form a place 'outside', bringing civilisation & the Arts. etc, etc - which was how I first read it.
davem is offline   Reply With Quote