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Originally Posted by davem
Apart from the Crebain & some flies with the eye of mordor on them, I can't think of any natural flying creatures that are evil. It is only 'monsters' like dragons, Thuringwethil & the Fell Beasts which can fly & are 'evil' - & one assumes they were bred to be so.
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Originally Posted by Lal
Neatly leaving Balrogs out of it due to not having wings, that's still a substantial amount of winged beasts that are on the side of darkness, especially given their size and potential for damage. . . . So maybe Tolkien did indeed associate most large winged beasts with evil. Certainly unnatural or supernatural winged creatures, as vampires, dragons and fell beasts were, unlike the Eagles.
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Perhaps the clue does not lie in wingedness per se but in unnatural wingedness or wingedness of gigantic proportions. The first might be seen as a kind of worshipping of false mechanical power, a denial of an animal's proper sphere and an appropriating to themselves the power and agency that four limbed critters should not have. The second might be related in that it defies laws of gravity. Just how big would a dragon's wings have to be to lift him? What size of muscles and weight of bone?
In contravening a natural order lies at least the beginning of taint.
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Originally Posted by Macalaure
the rest is left to 'the arts of Lúthien' - however we may exactly picture this.
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Originally Posted by Rune
I think the skin change is of a magical sort more than just simple disguises. I cannot say how Luthien and Beren transform into these creatures, because it is not told. But "magical" skin change is not an unknown thing. In alot of the old legends and in Norse Mythology you see this happen and are never told exactly how it is done.
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This takes us into the conflicted territory of elven 'magic' versus 'elven art.'
But I really ought to take a peek at The silm references myself. The very fact of having the phrase "vampire form" suggests that the author of The Silm assumed his readers would understand the word. Otherwise, why not simply say "bat form"? It's sort of like having your cake and eating it too.