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Old 07-25-2012, 02:49 PM   #28
Galin
Ghost Prince of Cardolan
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 1,031
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OK but you name 11 characters in all, and can't we add at least 3 more characters, leaving 6 (in addition to your Galadriel, Uinen, Ungoliant)?

I mean I'm not sure that the choice to not include the Athrabeth Finrod Ah Andreth (which leaves out Andreth but reduces the presence of Finrod, and leaves out an interesting detail about Aegnor) as an appendix to The Silmarillion easily falls into a characterization of choosing a shorter version of something over a longer version. The 6 I would list so far...

Galadriel
Uinen
Arien
Andreth
Beleth
Ungoliant

Arguably leaving (short versions versus long)...

Miriel
Nerdanel
Indis
Indis' daughters (although merely a footnote, at least in FM4 in any case)
Nellas (the long version here is the Narn)

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But not all of them. For instance, the two removals of the description of Galadriel as "valiant."
Please forgive me for restating a point here about Galadriel, but I'm guessing not everyone is going to read the linked thread. For now I won't go into my full case for why I think Galadriel has not been reduced in character, but I'll just note (and not that you said otherwise of course) that despite the changes you are referencing from HME here, the Silmarillion version that Christopher Tolkien published nonetheless specifically describes Galadriel as '... the only woman of the Noldor to stand that day tall and valiant among the contending princes, was eager...'


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Or substituting the Quenta passage in which only Ossë teaches the Teleri sea-lore for the Annals text in which both he and Uinen do so, despite the fact that the Annals is the main source for the that portion of that chapter (Chapter 5).

For that portion yes, but is not the Quenta the main source for chapter five in general?

If memory serves, on your chart you list it as the main source more often than the Annals of Aman at least. And unless I've missed something (possible, obviously), the Quenta passages for this part of the story do not mention Uinen at all, neither as present with Osse on the coasts of Middle-earth, or later upon Eressea. In the Quenta tradition (MR sections 36, 37) it is Osse not Uinen who comes to the coast to befriend the Teleri, and it's only Osse who instructs them at this point. And it is Osse not Uinen who later teaches them upon Eressea, and later again (43 and commentary) Osse alone teaches the Teleri the craft of ship building.

That's the Quenta tradition. The Annals however note (again, some Teleri having remained on the coasts of Middle-earth): 'And Osse and Uinen came to them and befriended them and taught them all manner of sea-lore and sea-music.' Annals of Aman section 66

But again, in the Quenta it is Osse alone who taught the teleri 'strange musics and sea-lore' -- although here when upon Tol Eressea -- as earlier it is only said in the Quenta that Osse instructed the Teleri generally. Thus when Christopher Tolkien merges the two texts it seems to me that he decides to give Uinen her presence with the Teleri, but keep Osse as the instructor of these specific things...

Quote:
'... and Osse and Uinen came to them and befriended them; and Osse instructed them, sitting upon a rock near to the margin of the land, and of him they learned all manner of sea-lore and sea-music.' 1977 Silmarillion
Thus the result of Christopher Tolkien employing the Annals for this portion of the story gives Uinen a presence in the book here, but Osse, who is much more weighted as instructor of the Teleri in the overall scenario, is given his specific teaching of music and lore -- taken from the Eressean passage in the Quenta.

Again, unless I've missed something here about the Quenta tradition.



By the way (something else I've wondered about), may I ask is there anyone outside of Uinen and Galadriel that you feel cannot be characterized as a minor character with respect to the Silmarillion?

Last edited by Galin; 07-25-2012 at 03:00 PM.
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