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Old 09-08-2017, 12:15 AM   #15
Balfrog
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“It is also possible to read "Green were his girdle and his breeches all of leather" to mean not only that both Tom's trousers and his belt are green, but also that they are both made of leather.”

Within the confines of the English language – I find such an interpretation as just about impossible. One might argue the leather breeches were green - but I can't see your suggestion at all. In any case, I'm glad you mentioned Occam's razor because a simple and direct interpretation of the verse – meaning the girdle is green and the breeches are leather – would be aligned with Occam's principle best.

As to the sequence of events in the 1962 The Adventures of Tom Bombadil poem – please read and take note of Tolkien's remarks in the preface of the associated booklet. Sequences of events cannot be determined precisely when the poetry has been made up from various legends and from different hobbit authors especially when transmitted orally.


Talking further about Occam's razor if you want to try and use it to pit a 'Nature' inspired green girdle versus a 'Mythological' green girdle – I believe the latter wins hands down. Thus I wholly disagree with:

“If we apply Occam's razor … symbolism wins out.”

Tolkien only ever wrote about one green girdle – and that's the 'default' mythological SGGK variety. There are no others ever documented that were specifically green and nature-inspired. 'O. r.' requires us to take the simplest and most straightforward path. Because no records of a nature version girdle exist – the default SGGK belt emerges as the front-runner.

We must not forget that 'green' as a color had a special meaning to Tolkien beyond 'nature':

“green was a fairy colour”
-SGGK, Tolkien & E.V. Gordon

I have no doubt green as a nature color was also important to Tolkien. So in this case, both possibilities are evenly matched in applying 'O.r'.

In this study, one should also weigh the reason behind the insertion of a new line in the 1962 The Adventures of Tom Bombadil poem. For a nature inspired green girdle – there are none given – but for a mythological one, Tolkien admits the new Bombadil poetry has specifically been formulated with linkage to our world. Given such an admission there is every reason to believe the poem's green girdle was yet another example. So again - advantage SGGK green girdle.

I could go further and throw in other factors to weigh – such as Tolkien's degree of pedantry, the state of his mental faculties at the time of composing the new verse, opportunities for correction, etc. etc. - but these would not help the 'nature' inspired green girdle case at all.

You are welcome to disagree – but overall the SGGK girdle wins out!

As far as the SGGK poem itself is concerned and whether the girdle is truly magical – I do not want to get into that debate. Whether we like it or not we are forced to take the unknown poet's words as transmitted by Lady Bertilak to be truthful. Again – as I communicated to Morthoron – Tolkien never called Lady Bertilak a liar.

When it comes to Goldberry's role in all of this – there is yet more evidence to come. Ms. Seth has has slowly built a case for a deep and hidden insertion of fairy tale and localized mythology within TLotR text. Gradually more and more information is coming out – that yes is entirely new. I know there will come a time when she pulls the threads together and explains how this all meshes. In the meantime she has just released how she believes an element of the fairy tale Childe Rowland was subtly incorporated into the Barrow-downs episode.
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