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Old 05-27-2007, 03:56 AM   #27
Findegil
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Interisting enough I found something, to support my idea of Andróg being a member of Húrins Band at Nargothrond. We used it already at the begining of the Narn:
Quote:
NA-TI-01b <Aelfwine & Dírhaval A Here begins that tale which {Ælfwine}[was] made from the {Húrinien}[Narn i Chîn Húrin]: ... From Mablung he learned much; and by fortune also he found a man named Andvír, and he was very old, but was the son of that Andróg who was in the outlaw-band of Túrin, and alone survived the battle on the summit of {Amon Rûdh}[Amon Rûð]. Otherwise all that time between the flight of Túrin from Doriath and his coming to Nargothrond, and Túrin's deeds in those days, would have remained hidden, save the little that was remembered among the people of Nargothrond concerning such matters as Gwindor or Túrin ever revealed. In this way also the matter of Mîm and his later dealings with Húrin were made clear. This lay was all that {Dírhavel}[Dírhaval] ever made, ...
Doesn't "In this way also the matter of Mîm and his later dealings with Húrin were made clear." in this context imply that Andróg witnessed these events as well? So may be we should skip the first healing of Andróg by Beleg and take only the wound recived on the summit of Amon Ruð, and use the note that the curse should bit agian in the meting of Húrin and his band including Andróg with Mîm at Nargothrond.

As yet this has only be a futtile idea, but since it finds now some support from inside Tolkiens on writings I like to concret the ideas of editing a bit more:
Quote:
Then Mîm rose, and looked long at Túrin. ‘I hear you,’ he said. ‘You speak like a Dwarf-lord of old; and at that I marvel. Now my heart is cooled, though it is not glad. My own ransom I will pay, therefore: you may dwell here, if you will. But this I will add: he that loosed the shaft shall break his bow and his arrows and lay them at my son's feet; and he shall never take arrow nor bear bow again. If he does, he shall die by it. That curse I lay on him.’
Andróg was afraid when he heard of this curse; and though he did so with great grudge, he broke his bow and his arrows and laid them at the dead Dwarf's feet. But as he came out from the chamber, he glanced evilly at Mîm, and muttered: ‘The curse of a Dwarf never dies, they say; but a Man's too may come home. NA-TI-09b May he die with a dart in his throat!{<NA; note 18 May he lack a bow at need ere his end.>}’{18}
...
Then Túrin was abashed, and in that matter overcame his pride.> NA-TI-15.3 and they{And his men} were quickly healed NA-EX-35.1 <CoH . For in those days the Grey-elves were still a high people, possessing great power, and they were wise in the ways of life and of all living things; and>{, for} though {the Grey-elves}<CoH they> were less in {skill and knowledge}<CoH craft and lore> than the Exiles from Valinor{, in the ways of the life of Middle-earth} they had {a wisdom}<CoH many arts> beyond the reach of Men. NA-EX-36d <Ap Narn {Andróg was cured of this wound by Beleg, but it seems that his dislike and distrust of the Elf was not thereby mitigated; and Mîm's hatred of Beleg became all the fiercer, for he had thus {"}undone{"} his curse upon Andróg. ‘It will bite again,’ he said. }It came into Mîm's mind that if he also ate the lembas of Melian he would renew his youth and grow strong again; and since he could not come at it by stealth he feigned sickness and begged it of his enemy. When Beleg refused it to him the seal was set upon Mîm's hatred, and all the more because of Túrin's love for the Elf.

> NA-TI-15.7 {And because}{Because Beleg}<CoH Moreover Beleg the Archer was great among the people of Doriath; he> was strong and enduring,<CoH and> far-sighted in mind as in eye, <CoH and at need he was valiant in battle, relying not only upon the swift arrows of his long bow, but also upon his great sword Anglachel.> {he}He came to be held in honour among the outlaws{; but the hatred of Mîm}<CoH And ever the more did hatred grow> for the Elf that had come into {Bar-en-Danwedh}[Bar-en-Danweð] {grew ever greater,} <CoH in the heart of Mîm, who hated all Elves, as has been told, and who looked with a jealous eye on the love that Túrin bore to Beleg.> {and}And he sat with Ibun his son in the deepest shadows of his house, speaking to none. But Túrin paid now little heed to the Dwarf{; and when}.
...
It has been told that when Mîm surrendered his hidden dwelling on {Amon Rûdh}[Amon Rûð] to Túrin and his company, he demanded that he who had loosed the arrow that slew his son should break his bow and his arrows and lay them at the feet of Khîm; and that man was Andróg. Then with great illwill Andróg did as Mîm bade. Moreover Mîm declared that Andróg must never again bear bow and arrow, and he laid a curse on him, that if nevertheless he should do so, then would he meet his own death by that means.
Now in the spring of that year Andróg defied the curse of Mîm and took up a bow again in a foray from {Bar-en-Danwedh}[Bar-en-Danweð] NA-EX-36c .{; and in that foray he was struck by a poisoned orc-arrow, and was brought back dying in pain. But Beleg healed him of his wound NA-EX-36b <Ap Narn {Andróg was cured of this wound by Beleg}, but {it seems that }his dislike and distrust of the Elf was not thereby mitigated>. And now the hatered that Mîm bore to Beleg was increased still more, for he had thus undone his curse; but ‘it will bite again,’ he said. It came into Mîm's mind that if he also ate the lembas of Melian he would renew his youth and grow strong again; and since he could not come at it by stealth he feigned sickness and begged it of his enemy. When Beleg refused it to him the seal was set upon Mîm's hatred, and all the more because of Túrin's love for the Elf.>}
...
Túrin and Beleg retreated into the cave, and rolled a great stone across the passage. In these straits Andróg revealed to them the hidden stair leading to the flat summit of {Amon Rûdh}[Amon Rûð] which he had found when lost in the caves, as has been told. Then Túrin and Beleg with many of their men went up by this stair and came out on the summit, surprising those few Orcs who had already come there by the outer path, and driving them over the edge. For a little while they held off the Orcs climbing up the rock, but they had no shelter on the bare summit, and many were shot from below. Most valiant of these was Andróg, who fell NA-SL-02c mortally wounded by an arrow at the head of the outside stair.
Then Túrin and Beleg with the ten men left to them drew back to the center of the summit, where was a standing stone, and making a ring about it they defended themselves until all were slain save Beleg and Túrin, for over them the orcs cast nets. Túrin was bound and carried off; Beleg who was wounded was bound likewise, but he was laid on the ground with wrists and ankles tied to iron pins driven in to the rock.
Now the Orcs, finding the issue of the secret stair, left the summit and entered {Bar-en-Danwedh}[Bar-en-Danweð], which they defiled and ravaged. They did not find Mîm, luking in his caves, and when they had departed from {Amon Rûdh}[Amon Rûð] Mîm appeared on the summit, and going to where Beleg lay prostrate and unmoving he gloated over him while he sharpend a knife.
But Mîm and Beleg were not the only living beings on that stony height. Andróg, though himself wounded NA-SL-02.1 to the death, crawled among the dead bodies towards them, and seizing a sword he thrust it at the Dwarf. Shrieking in fear Mîm ran to the brink of the cliff and disappeared: he fled down a steep and difficult goat’s path that was known to him. NA-EX-41b {<Ap Narn It was only then that {he}[Andróg] revealed to Túrin the existence of the inner stair; and he was one of those who came by that way to the summit. There he is said to have fought more valiantly than any, NA-SL-02 but he fell at last{ mortally} wounded {by an arrow; and thus the curse of Mîm was fulfilled.}> NA-TI-20 <Sil77 But a net was cast over Túrin as he fought, and he was enmeshed in it, and overcome, and led away.
And at length when all was silent again Mîm crept out of the shadows of his house; and as the sun rose over the mists of Sirion he stood beside the dead men on the hill-top. But he perceived that not all those that lay there were dead; for by one his gaze was returned, and he looked in the eyes of Beleg the Elf. Then with hatred long-stored Mîm stepped up to Beleg, and drew forth the sword Anglachel that lay beneath the body of one that had fallen beside him; but Beleg stumbling up seized back the sword and thrust it at the Dwarf, and Mîm in terror fled wailing from the hill-top.} And Beleg cried after him: ‘The vengeance of the house of Hador will find you yet!’> But Andróg putting forth his last strength cut through the wristbands and fetters that bound Beleg, and so released him NA-SL-02.2b {.}; but{ dying} he said: ‘My hurts are too deep even for your healing.’
The death of Beleg {NA-EX-42 <Lay Beleg>}
Beleg sought among the dead for Túrin, to bury him; but he could not discover his body. He knew then that Húrin’s son was still alive, and taken to Angband; but he remained perforce in {Bar-en-Danwedh}[Bar-en-Danweð] until his wounds were healed.> NA-TI-21b <Sil77 Now Beleg was sorely wounded, but he was mighty among the Elves of Middle-earth, and he was moreover a master of healing. Therefore he did not die, and slowly his strength returned; and {he sought in vain among the dead for Túrin, to bury him. But he found him not; and then he knew that Húrin's son was yet alive, and taken to Angband}. NA-EX-42.1b <Aelfwine & Dírhaval A And in this way also Andróg {who was in the outlaw-band of Túrin, and} alone[ of the outlaw-band of Túrin] survived the battle on the summit of {Amon Rûdh}[Amon Rûð],><CoH he was brought back dying in pain to Bar-enm-Danweð. But Beleg healed him of his wound NA-EX-36b <Ap Narn {Andróg was cured of this wound by Beleg}, but it seems that his dislike and distrust of the Elf was not thereby mitigated>. Then with{With} little hope Beleg departed from {Amon Rûdh}[Amon Rûð] and set out northward, towards the Crossings of {Teiglin}[Taeglin]{, following in the track of the Orcs; and he crossed over the Brithiach and journeyed through Dimbar towards the Pass of Anach. And now he was not far behind them, for he went without sleeping, whereas they had tarried on their road, hunting in the lands and fearing no pursuit as they came northward; and not even in the dreadful woods of Taur-nu-Fuin did he swerve from the trail, for the skill of Beleg was greater than any that have been in Middle-earth}.>NA-EX-43b <editorial bridge And of this in the Narn it is told:
><Lay NA-EX-44{he}He fared to the forest{. __ No}; __ no fellows sought he {735}
in his hopeless hazard, __ but in haste alone
he followed the feet __ of the foes of Elfland,
the dread daring, __ and the dire anguish,
that held the hearts __ of Hithlum's men 5
and Doriath's doughtiest __ in a dream of fear. {740}
...
...
...
RD-EX-02.5 <WH, Note 57 Húrin in Nargothrond>
§269 (§1d) RD-EX-02.7 <WH, Note 54, Text 2 But now Húrin {seems}seemed to pick up strength and youth - vengeance {seems}seemed to have heartened him, and he {[ ] and walks}walked now strongly. They {pass}passed into the woods <RD-EX-03 editorial addition to make a the term wood-men understandable south of Taeglin> and {gather}gathered the last fugitives of the wood-men (the kin of the folk of Brethil).>RD-EX-0.5 <TT; Note 33 {Now therefore he gathered to him a band of wild men, and they were waxen a fiercy and lawless folk that dwelt not with their kin, who thrust them into the hills to live or die as they might.}<taken from Lay of the Children of Húrin {till outcast folk
there}There also one by one,{ __ wild and reckless
}around him railed; /outcast folk, wild and reckless;/><taken from Sill77 such houseless and desperate man as could be found in those evil days lurking in the wild; and><[b]editorial addtion based on Aelfwine & Dírhaval A; taken from Narn[B] {The}the grimmest among them was {one named }Andróg,><Aelfwine & Dírhaval A who was in the outlaw-band of Túrin.>
§270 (§1e) RD-EX-04 <WH, Note 54, Text 1 {Asgorn}[Asgon] they {choose}chose for captain, but he {treats}treated Húrin as lord, and {does}did as he {will}willed. ...
...
Follwed by the scene of Mîm's death as in the last posting up to the point were Mîm uttered his 'it will bit again'. The rest of the passages in my last post is probably to freely interpreted to be useable in this project.

Respectfully
Findegil
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