'Westernesse' Movie Idea - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Eruhen · 07-17-2011, 01:37 PM

I don't know who else on the 'Downs has seen this; for all I know, I might be resurrecting a deceased equine just to flog it again, but here goes...

While wasting time with my secret vice on Ardalambion (yet again), I found a link to a little side project of Mr. Fauskanger's: a treatment for a potential prequel to both TH and LotR: a movie adaptation of the last part of the Akallabêth, specifically the pride of Ar-Pharazôn the Golden which culminated in the transportation of Sauron; the setting out of the Great Fleet into the West; and, finally, the Downfall, the establishment of the Realms in Exile, and the War of the Last Alliance. The movie would end with a rehash of the prequel to PJ's FotR.

Interested parties can view his work here. I think it looks good and, if I knew anyone in Hollywood and anyone who knew CJRT, would love to pitch it to New Line and the Professor's estate (seeing as the Estate still owns the rights to all of his works apart from TH and LotR).

Thoughts, comments, questions, nasty remarks?

Eruhen · 07-17-2011, 01:37 PM

And, apparently, you can't use HTML tags in thread titles.

*facepalm*

Morthoron · 07-17-2011, 02:40 PM

Based on Christopher Tolkien's litigious experiences with the current film producers (and anyone else who infringes on Tolkien trademarks, for that matter), not to mention the unabashed failure of Bakshi's cartoon, as well as his father's noted disgust with an early film script, I can't see the Tolkien Family Trust every granting film rights to material from The Silmarillion.

Nope, can't see it happening at all. At least not within CJRT's lifetime. Sorry, but ''a snowball's chance in hell'' is the apt metaphor here.

Inziladun · 07-17-2011, 03:19 PM

If PJ and Co. have served a positive purpose with their movies, it's that they've introduced Tolkien's work to a new generation, which hopefully will embrace the books and be motivated to look deeper into the LOTR universe, to the Silm and UT through that medium.
Making more movies, however, will do nothing but line pockets.

LadyBrooke · 07-17-2011, 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Morthoron

Nope, can't see it happening at all. At least not within CJRT's lifetime. Sorry, but ''a snowball's chance in hell'' is the apt metaphor here.

Neither can I...I do think one will happen one day though, probably not in any of our life times (unless some of our even younger then me members live to the ripe 100s), but as long as Congress (and the respective legislative bodies in other countries) don't bow to corporate greed and extend copyright*, it will be public domain one day.

On topic, I do agree that that's a very good script for a movie. I've read it before, liked it then, and still do.

*And if that happens, I really hope there is some kind of rebellion...or I can come back and haunt the legislature when I die. Once everybody involved in the making of it is dead, then it should be public domain. If you didn't make it, you shouldn't make millions of dollars off it.

Eruhen · 07-17-2011, 06:05 PM

I know it's probably not going to happen, but a wight can dream, can't he?

Also, who wants to start a betting pool on when/if H.K.F. is going to finish his rendition? It's been languishing for four or five years at the sailing of the Great Armament, so my guess is 'never'.

07-18-2011, 04:45 PM

I think the major problem with a movie about the Downfall would be the lack of original material. There are only a few hundred pages on the subject by Tolkien, and we know next to nothing about the characters, their relationships and personalities besides some general traits like pride and loyalty and some isolated hints - but that's it. How did Elendil talk (just look at the archaic manner of expression we see in Isildur's letter in The Council of Elrond)? Was Anarion a hothead or a calm and serene man ? How did the Elendili behave when they had to encounter the king on formal occasions? Was Ar-Pharazôns pride to be seen at first glance, or did he give the impression of a concerned father to his people?

And we know far less about Númenorean society at the end of the Second Age than we know about, say, Rohan or Minas Tirith at the time of the War of the Ring. Okay, people were corrupted by Sauron, afraid of dying, and engaged in a decadent imperialist culture, but how did that translate to their everyday behavior? Was the life of the upper class under Ar-Pharazôn opulent and escapist, or was there a grim militarism pervading every aspect of culture? How far did the opposition of the Faithful go, and what was their attitude on slavery, for example? Were there public debates, orators, assemblies? Did they have to go into a sort of inner exile? We know they were persecuted, but how exactly worked that persecution? What did Armenelos look like?

These are important aspects, I think, if one wants to have a lively portrayal of the story. Problem is, Tolkien doesn't give us a close look in the manner of the Lord of the Rings, so much has to be left to speculation. Any cinematic interpretation would therefore mainly rely on pure invention, and I doubt that this is what you and I really want.

07-17-2011, 01:37 PM	#1
Eruhen Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: At the Mountains of Madness Posts: 399	'Westernesse' Movie Idea I don't know who else on the 'Downs has seen this; for all I know, I might be resurrecting a deceased equine just to flog it again, but here goes... While wasting time with my secret vice on Ardalambion (yet again), I found a link to a little side project of Mr. Fauskanger's: a treatment for a potential prequel to both TH and LotR: a movie adaptation of the last part of the Akallabêth, specifically the pride of Ar-Pharazôn the Golden which culminated in the transportation of Sauron; the setting out of the Great Fleet into the West; and, finally, the Downfall, the establishment of the Realms in Exile, and the War of the Last Alliance. The movie would end with a rehash of the prequel to PJ's FotR. Interested parties can view his work here. I think it looks good and, if I knew anyone in Hollywood and anyone who knew CJRT, would love to pitch it to New Line and the Professor's estate (seeing as the Estate still owns the rights to all of his works apart from TH and LotR). Thoughts, comments, questions, nasty remarks? __________________ Agannâlô burôda nênud; zâira nênud. Adûn izindi batân tâidô ayadda: îdô kâtha batîna lôkhî. Êphalak îdôn Yôzâyan. Êphal êphalak îdôn hi-Akallabêth.

07-17-2011, 01:37 PM	#2
Eruhen Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: At the Mountains of Madness Posts: 399	And, apparently, you can't use HTML tags in thread titles. facepalm __________________ Agannâlô burôda nênud; zâira nênud. Adûn izindi batân tâidô ayadda: îdô kâtha batîna lôkhî. Êphalak îdôn Yôzâyan. Êphal êphalak îdôn hi-Akallabêth.

07-17-2011, 02:40 PM	#3
Morthoron Curmudgeonly Wordwraith Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Ensconced in curmudgeonly pursuits Posts: 2,504	Based on Christopher Tolkien's litigious experiences with the current film producers (and anyone else who infringes on Tolkien trademarks, for that matter), not to mention the unabashed failure of Bakshi's cartoon, as well as his father's noted disgust with an early film script, I can't see the Tolkien Family Trust every granting film rights to material from The Silmarillion. Nope, can't see it happening at all. At least not within CJRT's lifetime. Sorry, but ''a snowball's chance in hell'' is the apt metaphor here. __________________ And your little sister's immaculate virginity wings away on the bony shoulders of a young horse named George who stole surreptitiously into her geography revision.

07-17-2011, 03:19 PM	#4
Inziladun Gruesome Spectre Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Heaven's doorstep Posts: 8,035	If PJ and Co. have served a positive purpose with their movies, it's that they've introduced Tolkien's work to a new generation, which hopefully will embrace the books and be motivated to look deeper into the LOTR universe, to the Silm and UT through that medium. Making more movies, however, will do nothing but line pockets. __________________ Music alone proves the existence of God.

07-17-2011, 06:05 PM	#6
Eruhen Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: At the Mountains of Madness Posts: 399	I know it's probably not going to happen, but a wight can dream, can't he? Also, who wants to start a betting pool on when/if H.K.F. is going to finish his rendition? It's been languishing for four or five years at the sailing of the Great Armament, so my guess is 'never'. __________________ Agannâlô burôda nênud; zâira nênud. Adûn izindi batân tâidô ayadda: îdô kâtha batîna lôkhî. Êphalak îdôn Yôzâyan. Êphal êphalak îdôn hi-Akallabêth.

07-18-2011, 04:45 PM	#7
fimbulfambi Guest Posts: n/a	I think the major problem with a movie about the Downfall would be the lack of original material. There are only a few hundred pages on the subject by Tolkien, and we know next to nothing about the characters, their relationships and personalities besides some general traits like pride and loyalty and some isolated hints - but that's it. How did Elendil talk (just look at the archaic manner of expression we see in Isildur's letter in The Council of Elrond)? Was Anarion a hothead or a calm and serene man ? How did the Elendili behave when they had to encounter the king on formal occasions? Was Ar-Pharazôns pride to be seen at first glance, or did he give the impression of a concerned father to his people? And we know far less about Númenorean society at the end of the Second Age than we know about, say, Rohan or Minas Tirith at the time of the War of the Ring. Okay, people were corrupted by Sauron, afraid of dying, and engaged in a decadent imperialist culture, but how did that translate to their everyday behavior? Was the life of the upper class under Ar-Pharazôn opulent and escapist, or was there a grim militarism pervading every aspect of culture? How far did the opposition of the Faithful go, and what was their attitude on slavery, for example? Were there public debates, orators, assemblies? Did they have to go into a sort of inner exile? We know they were persecuted, but how exactly worked that persecution? What did Armenelos look like? These are important aspects, I think, if one wants to have a lively portrayal of the story. Problem is, Tolkien doesn't give us a close look in the manner of the Lord of the Rings, so much has to be left to speculation. Any cinematic interpretation would therefore mainly rely on pure invention, and I doubt that this is what you and I really want. Last edited by fimbulfambi; 07-18-2011 at 04:51 PM.