An odd picture - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Daisy Brambleburr · 09-27-2003, 11:18 AM

I was looking at these screencaps from the RotK trailer at the following <A HREF="http://orlandomultimedia.net/images/screencap/rotk/tv/rotk_tvad.html" TARGET=_blank>link</A> when I noticed this <A HREF="http://orlandomultimedia.net/images/screencap/rotk/tv/rotk_tvad_006.jpg" TARGET=_blank>picture</A> that I can't get my head around. Is that Eowyn? And what is she doing?? Any thoughts?[ September 27, 2003: Message edited by: Daisy Brambleburr ]

Lyta_Underhill · 09-27-2003, 11:53 AM

It looks to me like she is either donning or removing her helmet very quickly. My guess is that this is when she reveals herself to the Witch King, saying she is no man, but a woman, just before she and Merry slay him.Cheers, Lyta

Oddwen · 09-27-2003, 11:53 AM

She is taking off her helmet. I assume she is revealing herself to the Witch King.

HCIsland · 09-27-2003, 01:06 PM

It is wierd. It looks to me to be rather bright and cheery. Blue sky with puffy clouds in the background too.I think it may be a preduction shot and not from the film.By the way, the link doesn't work for me as the sight doesn't allow remote linking. Cutting and pasting this in works though. <A HREF="http://orlandomultimedia.net/images/screencap/rotk/tv/rotk_tvad_006.jpg" TARGET=_blank>http://orlandomultimedia.net/images/screencap/rotk/tv/rotk_tvad_006.jpg</A> H.C.H.C.

Daisy Brambleburr · 09-27-2003, 01:12 PM

I'm not too sure about the witchking thing. Your right, it does look like she's removing a helmet but I'm not sure if her facial expression or the lighting is right, unless the picture was captured at an odd time. If she was facing the Witchking I'd think that everything would be darker and she'd look much more grim and determind. But I can't think of any other explanation at the moment. But HC could be right, it could be a production shot. And also, thanks for the link.

ArathorofBarahir · 09-27-2003, 01:14 PM

It looks to me like she is revealing herself to the witchking.

Lyta_Underhill · 09-27-2003, 02:56 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>If she was facing the Witchking I'd think that everything would be darker and she'd look much more grim and determind. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Actually, much of the literature and accounts of warriors in battle have them charging with great big smiles on their faces, even more so than when normally happy. Perhaps she is speaking in defiance to the Witch King, smiling because she has duped him and is now about to meet her death in battle (as she believes). If indeed she is so close to her longed-for destiny, I would think a great big smile to be absolutely appropriate . I think it is apt and observant of Miranda to don such an expression as that when engaged in the heat of conflict. Far from the stereotypical "grim warrior," the rush of battle would evoke the same response in me, IMO, especially if I had been shut up for ages, longing for it. Go Eowyn! (If it is indeed a production shot and not the confrontation with the Witch King, well, then...who knows? ) Cheers, LytaP.S. I am rather amused by the open-mouthed sequence of Legolas shots below that, though! I ache to add a caption to one, complete with operatic lyrics...heh heh! [ September 27, 2003: Message edited by: Lyta_Underhill ]

Iarwain · 09-27-2003, 03:51 PM

Personally, I think that is the perfect smile for the witch king. Just imagine the laugh that accompanies it. The entire battle is too bright from the clips I've seen. The darkness from Mordor is mere cloud cover.Iarwain

Oddwen · 09-27-2003, 05:52 PM

"It seemed that Dernhelm laughed, and the clear voice was like the ring of steel. ...Backwards she sprang as the huge shape crashed to ruin, vast wings outspread, crumpled on the earth; and with its fall the shadow passed away. A light fell about her, and her hair shone in the sunrise."So, maybe it is somewhat accurate.

HCIsland · 09-27-2003, 06:32 PM

I was going through the trailer again and towards the end there are a series of very quick shots, one of which is Eowyn removing her helmet. It looks very much like the pic above, so I think folks are right here of the scene it is from.H.C.

Knight of Gondor · 09-27-2003, 09:11 PM

Yes, the book portrayed light shining down on her hair. I think that might work for the Witch-King, but somehow I pictured her more desperate looking. Maybe this is after a victory?

steve · 09-27-2003, 09:35 PM

I just reads the scene with Eowyn standing up to the witchking and I am certain that she was not smiling, for the way Tolkien had written her lines it seems that she has a very determined and focoused attitude, plus, why would she be cheery after Theoden was just killed?

Finwe · 09-27-2003, 11:03 PM

She didn't know that Theoden had been killed, she knew that he had been thrown by his horse, and she was trying to drive the Witch-king away from him.Most seasoned warriors laugh at war and battle, since they know that they will eventually die anyway, they also just laugh at their death. I would consider Eowyn a warrior, and she came to that realization a while back. She would be laughing at the Witch-king because, for the first time in her life, she had been treated completely as a man. The Witch-king didn't know she was a woman until she told him, and I think that Eowyn could have been laughing because of that also.

Evisse the Blue · 09-28-2003, 03:27 AM

I understand your points, Lyta and Finwe, but when I look at that pic, something just isn't right. This is hardly the smile I picture for such an occasion. That's the kind of smile you don when you say: "How do you do, Mr Witch King"

Elentári_O_Most_Mighty_1 · 09-28-2003, 04:21 AM

Well I don't think we can really judge until we see the actual film and how this part is portrayed. I myself am unsure- I shall sit on the fence on this one. But indeed, those Leggy shots are rather amusing.

09-29-2003, 08:15 AM

She takes of her helmet... I also think it is when she reveals herself to the witch king...

**The Saucepan Man** · 09-29-2003, 07:53 PM

I don't get why everyone thinks that Eowyn is smiling in that shot. It looks more like a look of grim determination to me. And yes, the shot is almost certainly from her encounter with the Witch King. If I am wrong, and she is smiling, it is no doubt a semi-victorious smile as she reveals herself as a woman, and therefore one to whom the Witch King is vulnerable. Presumably, Jackson will have the Witch King arrogantly declaring to her just before this that no living man may hinder him.

Olorin · 09-29-2003, 08:07 PM

It looks to me that all of those pictures have been super imposed... Like her head was put on someone else's body. Take another look, you'll see what I mean.

Olorin · 09-29-2003, 08:26 PM

Okay, I just saw the trailer, and although it does look like superimposition, it is really in there.It is Eowyn taking off her helmet quickly and her face is one of wrath not, joy.

Knight of Gondor · 09-29-2003, 08:37 PM

That looks like her cow-eyes for Aragorn in that smile...

samrohan · 10-02-2003, 06:03 AM

It probably is the scene when she reveals herself to the witch king but the look on her face looks more like the look of someone who has been offered a nice cold drink after filming a tiring scene.Also she looks too feminine to fool anyone into thinking she could have been Dernhelm.

Aduyuldaiel-MirkwoodPrincess · 10-02-2003, 09:51 AM

quite the baffeling picture...i wish i knew for sure...but i guess ill just have to wait for the movies

Knight of Gondor · 10-03-2003, 08:39 PM

I still don't know how one can laugh and not smile...

09-27-2003, 11:18 AM	#1
Daisy Brambleburr Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 334	An odd picture I was looking at these screencaps from the RotK trailer at the following <A HREF="http://orlandomultimedia.net/images/screencap/rotk/tv/rotk_tvad.html" TARGET=_blank>link</A><BR>when I noticed this <A HREF="http://orlandomultimedia.net/images/screencap/rotk/tv/rotk_tvad_006.jpg" TARGET=_blank>picture</A> that I can't get my head around. Is that Eowyn? And what is she doing?? <BR>Any thoughts?<p>[ September 27, 2003: Message edited by: Daisy Brambleburr ] __________________ 'What news from the South, O sighing wind, do you bring to me at eve? Where now is Boromir the Fair? He tarries and I grieve.'

09-27-2003, 11:53 AM	#2
Lyta_Underhill Haunted Halfling Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: an uncounted length of steps--floating between air molecules Posts: 841	It looks to me like she is either donning or removing her helmet very quickly. My guess is that this is when she reveals herself to the Witch King, saying she is no man, but a woman, just before she and Merry slay him.<P>Cheers,<BR>Lyta __________________ “…she laid herself to rest upon Cerin Amroth; and there is her green grave, until the world is changed, and all the days of her life are utterly forgotten by men that come after, and elanor and niphredil bloom no more east of the Sea.”

09-27-2003, 11:53 AM	#3
Oddwen Drummer in the Deep Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Next Sunday A.D. Posts: 2,145	She is taking off her helmet. I assume she is revealing herself to the Witch King. __________________ But all the while I sit and think of times there were before I listen for returning feet and voices at the door

09-27-2003, 01:06 PM	#4
HCIsland Zombie Cannibal Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 1,000	It is wierd. It looks to me to be rather bright and cheery. Blue sky with puffy clouds in the background too.<P>I think it may be a preduction shot and not from the film.<P>By the way, the link doesn't work for me as the sight doesn't allow remote linking. Cutting and pasting this in works though.<BR> <A HREF="http://orlandomultimedia.net/images/screencap/rotk/tv/rotk_tvad_006.jpg" TARGET=_blank>http://orlandomultimedia.net/images/screencap/rotk/tv/rotk_tvad_006.jpg</A> <P>H.C.<P>H.C. __________________ "Stir not the bitterness in the cup that I mixed myself. Have I not tasted it now many nights upon my tongue, foreboding that worse yet lay in the dregs." -Denethor

09-27-2003, 01:12 PM	#5
Daisy Brambleburr Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 334	I'm not too sure about the witchking thing. Your right, it does look like she's removing a helmet but I'm not sure if her facial expression or the lighting is right, unless the picture was captured at an odd time. If she was facing the Witchking I'd think that everything would be darker and she'd look much more grim and determind. But I can't think of any other explanation at the moment. But HC could be right, it could be a production shot. And also, thanks for the link. __________________ 'What news from the South, O sighing wind, do you bring to me at eve? Where now is Boromir the Fair? He tarries and I grieve.'

09-27-2003, 01:14 PM	#6
ArathorofBarahir Wight Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Crickhallow Posts: 247	It looks to me like she is revealing herself to the witchking. __________________ King of the Dead: The dead do not suffer the living to pass. Aragorn: You will suffer me.

09-27-2003, 02:56 PM	#7
Lyta_Underhill Haunted Halfling Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: an uncounted length of steps--floating between air molecules Posts: 841	<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>If she was facing the Witchking I'd think that everything would be darker and she'd look much more grim and determind. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Actually, much of the literature and accounts of warriors in battle have them charging with great big smiles on their faces, even more so than when normally happy. Perhaps she is speaking in defiance to the Witch King, smiling because she has duped him and is now about to meet her death in battle (as she believes). If indeed she is so close to her longed-for destiny, I would think a great big smile to be absolutely appropriate . I think it is apt and observant of Miranda to don such an expression as that when engaged in the heat of conflict. Far from the stereotypical "grim warrior," the rush of battle would evoke the same response in me, IMO, especially if I had been shut up for ages, longing for it. Go Eowyn!<BR>(If it is indeed a production shot and not the confrontation with the Witch King, well, then...who knows? ) <P>Cheers,<BR>Lyta<P>P.S. I am rather amused by the open-mouthed sequence of Legolas shots below that, though! I ache to add a caption to one, complete with operatic lyrics...heh heh! <p>[ September 27, 2003: Message edited by: Lyta_Underhill ] __________________ “…she laid herself to rest upon Cerin Amroth; and there is her green grave, until the world is changed, and all the days of her life are utterly forgotten by men that come after, and elanor and niphredil bloom no more east of the Sea.”

09-27-2003, 03:51 PM	#8
Iarwain Pugnaciously Primordial Paradox Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Birnham Wood Posts: 800	Personally, I think that is the perfect smile for the witch king. Just imagine the laugh that accompanies it. The entire battle is too bright from the clips I've seen. The darkness from Mordor is mere cloud cover.<P>Iarwain __________________ "And what are oaths but words we say to God?"

09-27-2003, 05:52 PM	#9
Oddwen Drummer in the Deep Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Next Sunday A.D. Posts: 2,145	"It seemed that Dernhelm laughed, and the clear voice was like the ring of steel.<BR>...Backwards she sprang as the huge shape crashed to ruin, vast wings outspread, crumpled on the earth; and with its fall the shadow passed away. A light fell about her, and her hair shone in the sunrise."<P>So, maybe it is somewhat accurate. __________________ But all the while I sit and think of times there were before I listen for returning feet and voices at the door

09-27-2003, 06:32 PM	#10
HCIsland Zombie Cannibal Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 1,000	I was going through the trailer again and towards the end there are a series of very quick shots, one of which is Eowyn removing her helmet. It looks very much like the pic above, so I think folks are right here of the scene it is from.<P>H.C. __________________ "Stir not the bitterness in the cup that I mixed myself. Have I not tasted it now many nights upon my tongue, foreboding that worse yet lay in the dregs." -Denethor

09-27-2003, 09:11 PM	#11
Knight of Gondor Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Kentucky Posts: 744	Yes, the book portrayed light shining down on her hair. I think that might work for the Witch-King, but somehow I pictured her more desperate looking. Maybe this is after a victory? __________________ Eagerly awaiting the REAL Return of the King - Jesus Christ! Revelation 19:11-16

09-27-2003, 09:35 PM	#12
steve Wight Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Edoras... er, Philadelphia Posts: 191	I just reads the scene with Eowyn standing up to the witchking and I am certain that she was not smiling, for the way Tolkien had written her lines it seems that she has a very determined and focoused attitude, plus, why would she be cheery after Theoden was just killed? __________________ MAGIC SHOP! Spells of Mass Destruction 20% off! Today Only!

09-27-2003, 11:03 PM	#13
Finwe Deathless Sun Join Date: May 2003 Location: The Royal Suite in the Halls of Mandos Posts: 2,609	She didn't know that Theoden had been killed, she knew that he had been thrown by his horse, and she was trying to drive the Witch-king away from him.<P>Most seasoned warriors laugh at war and battle, since they know that they will eventually die anyway, they also just laugh at their death. I would consider Eowyn a warrior, and she came to that realization a while back. She would be laughing at the Witch-king because, for the first time in her life, she had been treated completely as a man. The Witch-king didn't know she was a woman until she told him, and I think that Eowyn could have been laughing because of that also. __________________ But Melkor also was there, and he came to the house of Fëanor, and there he slew Finwë King of the Noldor before his doors, and spilled the first blood in the Blessed Realm; for Finwë alone had not fled from the horror of the Dark.

09-28-2003, 03:27 AM	#14
Evisse the Blue Brightness of a Blade Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: wherever I may roam Posts: 2,685	I understand your points, Lyta and Finwe, but when I look at that pic, something just isn't right. This is hardly the smile I picture for such an occasion. That's the kind of smile you don when you say: "How do you do, Mr Witch King" __________________ And no one was ill, and everyone was pleased, except those who had to mow the grass.

09-28-2003, 04:21 AM	#15
Elentári_O_Most_Mighty_1 Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Up a tree somewhere in Caras Galadhon...or England Posts: 364	Well I don't think we can really judge until we see the actual film and how this part is portrayed. I myself am unsure- I shall sit on the fence on this one.<BR>But indeed, those Leggy shots are rather amusing. __________________ '"Forweg can lead you no longer; for he is dead...I slew him...I will govern this fellowship now, or leave it." "As it was when he joined us, so it is again. He kills to make room."'

09-29-2003, 08:15 AM	#16
The Shoulder Guest Posts: n/a	She takes of her helmet... I also think it is when she reveals herself to the witch king...

09-29-2003, 07:53 PM	#17
The Saucepan Man Corpus Cacophonous Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: A green and pleasant land Posts: 8,390	I don't get why everyone thinks that Eowyn is smiling in that shot. It looks more like a look of grim determination to me. And yes, the shot is almost certainly from her encounter with the Witch King. <P>If I am wrong, and she is smiling, it is no doubt a semi-victorious smile as she reveals herself as a woman, and therefore one to whom the Witch King is vulnerable. Presumably, Jackson will have the Witch King arrogantly declaring to her just before this that no living man may hinder him. __________________ Do you mind? I'm busy doing the fishstick. It's a very delicate state of mind!

09-29-2003, 08:07 PM	#18
Olorin Wight Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Where the sun sails and the moon walks. Posts: 155	It looks to me that all of those pictures have been super imposed... Like her head was put on someone else's body. Take another look, you'll see what I mean. __________________ Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then don't be too eager to deal out death in judgement. For even the very wise cannot see all ends.

09-29-2003, 08:26 PM	#19
Olorin Wight Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Where the sun sails and the moon walks. Posts: 155	Okay, I just saw the trailer, and although it does look like superimposition, it is really in there.<P>It is Eowyn taking off her helmet quickly and her face is one of wrath not, joy. __________________ Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then don't be too eager to deal out death in judgement. For even the very wise cannot see all ends.

09-29-2003, 08:37 PM	#20
Knight of Gondor Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Kentucky Posts: 744	That looks like her cow-eyes for Aragorn in that smile... __________________ Eagerly awaiting the REAL Return of the King - Jesus Christ! Revelation 19:11-16

10-02-2003, 06:03 AM	#21
samrohan Wight Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Touring Minas Tirith with Gimli and Legolas Posts: 107	It probably is the scene when she reveals herself to the witch king but the look on her face looks more like the look of someone who has been offered a nice cold drink after filming a tiring scene.<P>Also she looks too feminine to fool anyone into thinking she could have been Dernhelm. __________________ I can't believe I have not watched the return of the king yet.

10-02-2003, 09:51 AM	#22
Aduyuldaiel-MirkwoodPrincess Haunting Spirit Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: MirkWood Posts: 73	quite the baffeling picture...i wish i knew for sure...but i guess ill just have to wait for the movies __________________ "when all is said and done and dead does he love you the way that i do?"

10-03-2003, 08:39 PM	#23
Knight of Gondor Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Kentucky Posts: 744	I still don't know how one can laugh and not smile... __________________ Eagerly awaiting the REAL Return of the King - Jesus Christ! Revelation 19:11-16