Heroes: LOTR vs Rocky Balboa - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

08-30-2006, 12:43 AM

Much may be made of Frodo, Sam, Gandalf etc as heroes of the LOTR in the movies. But how do you think they compare in standing to heroes in other big movies? For me, there never was, nor ever will be, a greater hero than Rocky Balboa.

Selmo · 08-30-2006, 02:31 AM

Rocky fought for personal glory and profit. He fought only for himself and his immediate family.

In my opinion, a hero is someone who fights for some greater good.
.

narfforc · 08-30-2006, 04:40 AM

Yes but can you just hear Aragorn shouting at his coronation: YO ARWEN I DONE IT.

Love the Rocky films.

Bêthberry · 08-30-2006, 08:16 AM

Well, this is a case where knowledge from outside the story now influences my reading of Rocky. I'm not sure in this case if davem would agree it should ruin the story.

I've heard that in his first film Stallone was the kind of superhero that our Lord of the Rings heroes are not and that makes any kind of comparison between the ring and the Ring just fall flat for me.

Lalwendë · 08-30-2006, 08:28 AM

Don't superheroes all wear tight-fitting masks and lycra unitards and wear their underpants over their kecks? Sounds a bit dodgy to me.

narfforc · 08-30-2006, 09:21 AM

Aren't they those Wrestlers from WWE.con. I am sorry for seeing the fun element here Mansun, but the Rocky films are hardly the ones to use when speaking of an Hero, there are many war films, where groups of soldiers set of in Fellowship to fight the enemy, maybe that is what you are asking, can we see the Lord of the Rings type Hero in other places.

08-30-2006, 10:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lalwendë

Don't superheroes all wear tight-fitting masks and lycra unitards and wear their underpants over their kecks? Sounds a bit dodgy to me.

I can just imagine Gandalf the White in his tights?!?

Or maybe The Saucepan Man?

08-30-2006, 06:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by narfforc

Yes but can you just hear Aragorn shouting at his coronation: YO ARWEN I DONE IT.

Why not? Though I would think he would say WE did it.

The 1,000 Reader · 08-30-2006, 08:18 PM

I believe that this is the first time someone has double/triple posted here.

Overall, the LOTR characters are more heroic than Rocky. Rocky was a great man, but he just doesn't compare to the likes of Aragorn.

08-30-2006, 06:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Selmo

Rocky fought for personal glory and profit. He fought only for himself and his immediate family.

In my opinion, a hero is someone who fights for some greater good.
.

Do you not forget the good behind the theme of Rocky IV? It is an indirect battle between USA & Russia over the Cold War, only in the ring.

Lalwendë · 08-31-2006, 02:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mansun

Do you not forget the good behind the theme of Rocky IV? It is an indirect battle between USA & Russia over the Cold War, only in the ring.

That wouldn't make a very good comparison with Tolkien's work at all I'm afraid. His work is about a definite good/evil fight - though he does invest this with many shades of grey and is not morally absolute (e.g. Gollum, baddies being 'forgiven' etc). Rocky IV though, presented the Cold War as a straight good/evil fight when it was not; it was more about two extreme political systems posturing against each other and putting the world in peril.

narfforc · 08-31-2006, 02:59 AM

I saw a different side to Rocky IV than the political one, and that was old school training versus new technology/drug abuse in sport, now that is far more good vs evil than the political views portrayed in the film, one could see comparisons to some themes in LotR ie: The true grit of the west vs the techno filth of Saruman, the overwhelming odds for the Russian superman to destroy the smaller Rocky, are similar to those faced at Helms Deep, Rocky fought with the desire to avenge the death of Apollo Creed, and the Rohirrim had lost Theodred.

Lalwendë · 08-31-2006, 04:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by narfforc

I saw a different side to Rocky IV than the political one, and that was old school training versus new technology/drug abuse in sport, now that is far more good vs evil than the political views portrayed in the film, one could see comparisons to some themes in LotR ie: The true grit of the west vs the techno filth of Saruman, the overwhelming odds for the Russian superman to destroy the smaller Rocky, are similar to those faced at Helms Deep, Rocky fought with the desire to avenge the death of Apollo Creed, and the Rohirrim had lost Theodred.

I can see those comparisons working. But the political angle wouldn't work, mostly as its seen now that both sides were wrong in the Cold War! And in any case, if that one was to work in terms of size and technology available to the two powers facing each other, then we'd have to say that Gondor = USSR and Mordor = USA, and I'm sure a lot of people wouldn't be happy with that.

08-30-2006, 12:43 AM	#1
Mansun Guest Posts: n/a	Heroes: LOTR vs Rocky Balboa Much may be made of Frodo, Sam, Gandalf etc as heroes of the LOTR in the movies. But how do you think they compare in standing to heroes in other big movies? For me, there never was, nor ever will be, a greater hero than Rocky Balboa. Last edited by Mansun; 08-30-2006 at 10:23 PM.

08-30-2006, 04:40 AM	#3
narfforc Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Muddy-earth Posts: 1,297	Yes but can you just hear Aragorn shouting at his coronation: YO ARWEN I DONE IT. Love the Rocky films. __________________ [B]THE LORD OF THE GRINS:THE ONE PARODY....A PARODY BETTER THAN THE RINGS OF POWER.

08-30-2006, 08:16 AM	#4
Bêthberry Cryptic Aura Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 6,003	Well, this is a case where knowledge from outside the story now influences my reading of Rocky. I'm not sure in this case if davem would agree it should ruin the story. I've heard that in his first film Stallone was the kind of superhero that our Lord of the Rings heroes are not and that makes any kind of comparison between the ring and the Ring just fall flat for me. __________________ I’ll sing his roots off. I’ll sing a wind up and blow leaf and branch away.

08-30-2006, 08:28 AM	#5
Lalwendë A Mere Boggart Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: under the bed Posts: 4,737	Don't superheroes all wear tight-fitting masks and lycra unitards and wear their underpants over their kecks? Sounds a bit dodgy to me. __________________ Gordon's alive!

08-30-2006, 09:21 AM	#6
narfforc Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Muddy-earth Posts: 1,297	Aren't they those Wrestlers from WWE.con. I am sorry for seeing the fun element here Mansun, but the Rocky films are hardly the ones to use when speaking of an Hero, there are many war films, where groups of soldiers set of in Fellowship to fight the enemy, maybe that is what you are asking, can we see the Lord of the Rings type Hero in other places. __________________ [B]THE LORD OF THE GRINS:THE ONE PARODY....A PARODY BETTER THAN THE RINGS OF POWER. Last edited by narfforc; 08-30-2006 at 09:27 AM.

08-30-2006, 02:31 AM	#2
Selmo Shade of Carn Dûm Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: The Shire (Staffordshire), United Kingdom Posts: 273	Rocky fought for personal glory and profit. He fought only for himself and his immediate family. In my opinion, a hero is someone who fights for some greater good. .

08-30-2006, 08:18 PM	#9
The 1,000 Reader Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: I don't know. Eastern ME doesn't have maps. Posts: 527	I believe that this is the first time someone has double/triple posted here. Overall, the LOTR characters are more heroic than Rocky. Rocky was a great man, but he just doesn't compare to the likes of Aragorn. __________________ "And forth went Morgoth, and he was halted by the elves. Then went Sauron, who was stopped by a dog and then aged men. Finally, there came the Witch-King, who destroyed Arnor, but nobody seems to remember that." -A History of Villains

08-31-2006, 02:59 AM	#12
narfforc Ghost Prince of Cardolan Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Muddy-earth Posts: 1,297	I saw a different side to Rocky IV than the political one, and that was old school training versus new technology/drug abuse in sport, now that is far more good vs evil than the political views portrayed in the film, one could see comparisons to some themes in LotR ie: The true grit of the west vs the techno filth of Saruman, the overwhelming odds for the Russian superman to destroy the smaller Rocky, are similar to those faced at Helms Deep, Rocky fought with the desire to avenge the death of Apollo Creed, and the Rohirrim had lost Theodred. __________________ [B]THE LORD OF THE GRINS:THE ONE PARODY....A PARODY BETTER THAN THE RINGS OF POWER.

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