Sage Hobbit movie advice for PJ?

[Tuor of Gondolin]

Numerous comments have been made about the pluses and minuses
of PJ's LOTR movies. How about some preemptive suggestions, which
he would no doubt be grateful for on making The Hobbit.

Here ar some possibles:
1) make it a two-part movie, more time to cover the story, but
more importantly, lotd more $$$$$$$$$$$$$$ (or pounds) (or euros).
2) Part one ends with Thorin and Co. entering Mirkwood and the
White Council taking Dol Guldur.
3) Part one romantic interest (okay, a little playing with Middle-earth
history is involved in some of these ideas), Aragorn and Arwen's first
meeting (yeah, he was really about 10, and not yet invented when the
Hobbit was written, but PJ makes him 20).
4) Since it's unclear who actually was in the attack on Dol Guldur, and
knowing PJ's battle scene fetish, include elves and Dunedain in the
attack (Aragorn can "earn his spurs" and impress his mates). Also
have the hint of tension between Gandalf and Saruman.
5) In Part II Legolas is present. If he had been invented it's very
possible Thranduil's son would have been involved and in LOTR I don't
believe there's any "Oh hi, Gandalf, we've never met before, I'm..."
6) Part II love interest, either Bard has a girlfriend (he shoots Smaug
just before she gets really hot, or Legolas with any available
elf or Laketown girl.
7) Part II bits with Aragorn fighting for Gondor, and a young Denethor
getting steamed with Aragorn's success. Again, dates and the ages of
people are a bit off but I think it sticks, at least in the movie
universe, closish to Middle-earth events, and it allws especially
non-book people to relate to more characters.
8) Casting--- Unfortunately, Ian Holmes would probably be not only too
old for Bilbo, but not up to the almost total screen time the character
would call for. But movie Aragorn, Arwen, Gandalf, Galadriel, Agent Elrond,
John-Rhys Davies as Thorin Oakenshield, Smeagol, etc.


I believe the changes above are less intrusive (philosophically) then PJ's LOTR
changes, and I'm actually about 70-80% serious about them. Any comments
and/or other helpful hints for PJ, which he is no doubt eagerly awaiting?

[Encaitare]

Most of your points seem to be the "logical" thing to be done for a film (or pair of films) but I really wish he'd stick closer to the text this time around. I like the idea of Bard having a girlfriend or love interest, but not Aragorn and Arwen meeting then. And although your point about Legolas probably having met Gandalf earlier, I don't want ol' Orlando in this one... no more rabid Leggy fangirls, thank you.

[lotrfreak90]

Peter Jackson is no longer aloud making the Hobbit because of the way he changed some of the text. Tolkiens son specifically made the deal that he could make the movies as long as he changed NOTHNG so when he changed all the little bits and bobs that he did young tolkien called the deal off and is not letting him do the hobbit.

people can be real ignorant

[The Saucepan Man]

Originally Posted by lotrfreak

Peter Jackson is no longer aloud making the Hobbit because of the way he changed some of the text. Tolkiens son specifically made the deal that he could make the movies as long as he changed NOTHNG so when he changed all the little bits and bobs that he did young tolkien called the deal off and is not letting him do the hobbit.

Actually, Tolkien's estate had no say in the making of the LotR films, and they have no say in whether The Hobbit will be made as a film, since Tolkien sold the film rights during his lifetime (hence the cartoon films). There is, however, a dispute between New Line and the studio which owns the rights (I forget which). However, given the potential money to be made, I have little doubt that this will be resolved.

Jackson has expressed an interest in making a film of The Hobbit, although it will have to wait until he has finished filming his re-make of King Kong. Ian McKellan has also expressed an interest in reprising his role as Gandalf. I recently read an interview with Iain Holm, however, where he reluctantly conceded that he is (being in his 70s) too old to play Bilbo (although charmingly he added that he would not be too old in Hobbit years).

people can be real ignorant

Dangerous words.

I like some of your ideas, Tuor of Gondolin. Including the White Council's attack on Dol Guldur is a great idea, and has been mooted elsewhere in this forum. Having it at the end of the first film would work well and nicely dispose of Sauron to set up Smaug as the main villain for the second (although perhaps Sauron could remain as the "controlling force" behind the Goblin Army).

Difficult to see where the love interest will come from other than with Bard (perhaps with an Elven maiden from Thranduil's realm), unless they make some of the Dwarves female. Of course, given the statement made by Gimli in TTT concerning Dwarven women, it might be difficult to tell which is which.

And talking of the Dwarves, it has been suggested (in another thread here) that they might cut down on the number to avoid confusing the audience. That would be a shame, but I can see the logic of it.

Personally, I think including Aragorn and Arwen would be a mistake, since they would not be the focus of the film and too much additional story and film time would be taken up giving them greater roles. But a young Legolas in a cameo role would be fun. Or perhaps an older Orlando Bloom could play Thranduil (and John Rhys-Davies could play Gloin, although he is unlikely to fancy that make-up job again). And no prizes for guessing who is likely to play Gollum.

One further thought. Having Christopher Lee reprise his role as Saruman would be great, if the film is to include scenes involving the White Council. Having him play the innocent at the Council while plotting behind their backs (and giving Gandalf the "evil eye") would be great.

Finally, as I have said elsewhere, my choice for Smaug's voice would most definately be Jeremy Irons.

[Tuor of Gondolin]

"Difficult to see where the love interest will come from other than with Bard (perhaps with an Elven maiden from Thranduil's realm), unless they make some of the Dwarves female.
"-------------------------------------
How about Orlando and a female relative of Gloin's?
It would sure give a new interpretation to the Legolas/GimliLOTR relationship!
________________________
Actually, one of the attractions of doing a movie Hobbit is that you
can make certain improvs like Dol Guldur or Legolas without directly
contravening the Middle-earth world. It's one of the reasons I wish CT
wasn't so hard-nosed about advising PJ and friends. He could have
done a lot to improve the end result.

I kind of like Orlando doing Thranduil (only a minor challenge for WETA)
and Christopher Lee could have some serious fun playing Saruman as you
describe. Once again, it keeps to the spirit of JRRT while giving
scriptwriters and actors some leeway for creativity.

One reason for suggesting Aragorn/Arwen is so non-book readers
won't be asking during the film: "Where's that cute elvish babe?
"Yeah, and what about hunky Aragorn?"

The Hobbit might be even better suited for PJ then LOTR, a fairly
straightforward, linear, storyline with lots of special effects opportunities
(the trolls, Beorn [could be shown changing], the Mirkwood Spiders,
going down the river in barrels, Smaug, etc).

About John-Rhys Davies. Yes, WETA would have to make major improvements
to get him back. But remember, they were doing some cutting edge
work, so you'd assume they would make a point of improving make-up. I
suggested Thorin to give him a bigger role, and his voice sounds like
Thorin's to me, but you could expand Gloin's role. I suppose the dwarf
number has to be reduced. Would hobbits be added? How about Trotter?

And if Jeremy Irons isn't available, what about Danny DeVito or Bill Murray?

[Sapphire_Flame]

And if Jeremy Irons isn't available, what about Danny DeVito or Bill Murray?

Danny DeVito or Bill Murray? What, are you freakin' kidding me? *shakes head emphatically* I seriously don't see either of them working in that part. I think they should try for Jeremy Irons. Or maybe Jason Isaacs. *nod nod*

I am inclined to disagree with the insertion of Aragorn and Arwen; this isn't a reprise of LotR, and not all the characters from it need be in The Hobbit. The Hobbit is a book with *no* romantic detours whatsoever. It doesn't need them, it's more of a children's book. I don't think PJ would be justified in adding them in.

The idea for showing the attack on Dol Guldur sounds good. I've wondered what that battle would be like...

Abedithon le,

~ Saphy ~