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Old 09-15-2006, 12:07 PM   #1
Aiwendil
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The Quenta Silmarillion itself is preceded by two short works, the first of which is the Ainulindale, Tolkien’s “cosmogonical” myth. Rather than beginning in medias res, Tolkien starts his tale literally at the very beginning, with the creation of the world. I feel I must confess up front that the Ainulindale is one of my favorite pieces of writing, by Tolkien or by anyone else.

It is interesting to compare the Ainulindale with other creation myths. Perhaps the most obvious comparison one can make is with the Judeo-Christian creation story told in Genesis. We know, of course, that Tolkien was Catholic; but I think that there are as many interesting differences between the Ainulindale and Genesis as there are similarities. One thing that strikes me is the crucial role that the Ainur play in the creation, which doesn’t seem to be mirrored by anything in the Judeo-Christian story.

A survey of other creation myths – Greek, Norse, Egyptian, etc. – might also shed interesting light on the Ainulindale. From the little I know about these various stories, it seems to me that Tolkien’s creation myth is at once quite novel and firmly in the tradition of “real” origin stories.

Tolkien chose to have his world created through song. What does this say about it? Perhaps it would be more accurate to say that his world was designed through song, for it is only when Iluvatar speaks the word of command – Ea! – that Arda is brought into actual existence. The power ascribed to a word is perhaps not so surprising, considering Tolkien’s profession. It also calls to mind the New Testament – “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.” Though I wonder whether to see some connection here is to mistakenly read elements of Tolkien’s real life and religion into his sub-creation.

Another point on which the same question arises is the “Secret Fire” or the “Flame Imperishable”. We are never told what exactly this is, though it appears to be some kind of creative force, and it is said to be “with Iluvatar”. Might this be related to the “Holy Spirit” of Christian theology? Or would that, again, be a misreading?

Many further questions can be raised about the Music of the Ainur (perhaps it is this slightly enigmatic quality of the work that makes it so appealing). For instance, is all of creation embodied in the Music? If so, what implications does that raise for free will in Arda? What is the significance of the three themes of Iluvatar? We are told that the Children – Men and Elves – entered only in the third theme; what then is the significance of the Second? Tolkien deals with some of these issues in several texts found in HoMe X, but more often than not, these explications only raise further questions.

The textual history of the Ainulindale is unusually simple. The first version is “The Music of the Ainur”, found in the Book of Lost Tales. It was to a revision of this text written in the 1930s that Tolkien first gave the title “Ainulindale”; a further revision followed the completion of LotR. Christopher Tolkien notes that this is the only section of the Silmarillion for which there is a direct lineage, as it were, of manuscripts, each one a revision of the last. In fact, many turns of phrase in the original Tale are strikingly similar to the final text, written nearly thirty years later. One wonders why it is that, while so many of the stories in the Silmarillion were in constant flux, the creation story proved so enduring.

One curiosity in the history of the Ainulindale is a divergent version, which Christopher calls Ainulindale C*. In this, which appears to be the first post-LotR revision of the story, the cosmology is altered so that the Earth is round and the Sun and Moon in existence from the beginning. The subsequent revisions reverse this change, but years later Tolkien would again consider making such radical alterations to the cosmology of his Legendarium.

Additional readings:
HoMe I, “The Music of the Ainur” (for the earliest version of the story)
HoMe V, “Ainulindale” (for the 1930s revision)
HoMe X, “Ainulindale” (for the post-LotR revisions)
HoMe X, author’s commentary on “Athrabeth Finrod ah Andreth” (for Tolkien’s musings on some issues related to the Ainulindale)
HoMe X, “Myths Transformed” (for the late cosmological changes)
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Old 09-15-2006, 01:54 PM   #2
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Originally Posted by Aiwendil
I feel I must confess up front that the Ainulindale is one of my favorite pieces of writing, by Tolkien or by anyone else.
I think you spoke for most (all) of Barrowdown
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Originally Posted by Aiwendil
One thing that strikes me is the crucial role that the Ainur play in the creation, which doesn’t seem to be mirrored by anything in the Judeo-Christian story.
Then again, that is downplayed by the fact that all themes originate in Iluvatar: "and thou, Melkor, shalt see that no theme may be played that hath not its uttermost source in me"
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Originally Posted by Aiwendil
Though I wonder whether to see some connection here is to mistakenly read elements of Tolkien’s real life and religion into his sub-creation.
In his view, myth-making is to return to our initial state, before the Fall, and it reflects God's Truth. Imo, these are all of Christian nature to him.
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Originally Posted by Aiwendil
We are never told what exactly this is, though it appears to be some kind of creative force, and it is said to be “with Iluvatar”.
Clyde S. Kilby notes in his book "Tolkien as Christian Writer" that:
Quote:
Professor Tolkien talked to me at some length about the use of the word "holy" in The Silmarillion. Very specifically he told me that the "Secret Fire sent to burn at the heart of the world" in the beginning was the Holy Spirit
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Originally Posted by Aiwendil
For instance, is all of creation embodied in the Music?
.
No:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ainulindale
Yet some things there are that they cannot see, neither alone nor taking counsel together; for to none but himself has Iluvatar revealed all that he has in store, and in every age there come forth things that are new and have no foretelling, for they do not proceed from the past.
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Originally Posted by Aiwendil
If so, what implications does that raise for free will in Arda?
Free will operates within certain limits:
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Originally Posted by Letter #153
Free Will is derivative, and is only operative within provided circumstances; but in order that it may exist, it is necessary that the Author should guarantee it, whatever betides : sc. when it is 'against His Will', as we say, at any rate as it appears on a finite view. He does not stop or make 'unreal' sinful acts and their consequences.
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Old 09-15-2006, 03:59 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by Aiwendil
I feel I must confess up front that the Ainulindale is one of my favorite pieces of writing, by Tolkien or by anyone else.
The Ainulindalë, for me, is one of the loveliest oral/aural pieces I've come across. It has a rhythm and flow to it that is very pleasant to my ear . . . the repetition of sounds in the sentences and how the words are put together or spaced apart reminds me at times of a river's water sliding over stones of differing sizes, over sandy bars, and bumping with varying degrees of force against those things which have fallen into it before flowing on again.

I have to say, when I first got a copy of the Silmarillion, sometime in the late '70's, I found it rather a dry read. Histories have never captured my interest; and it was difficult to switch from reading Tolkien as an exciting novelist to Tolkien the historian. Suffice it to say, it took me a long time to read through it.

I've found it much easier to listen to the writings in the Silmarillion than to read them. Tolkien, that way, comes through as still the great story-teller for me when I listen to the Sil.

And for those who might also find it a bit ponderous to plow through, I'd like to recommend the boxed set (13 CD's) read by Martin Shaw.

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Old 09-15-2006, 07:01 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by Pio
The Ainulindalë, for me, is one of the loveliest oral/aural pieces I've come across. It has a rhythm and flow to it that is very pleasant to my ear . . . the repetition of sounds in the sentences and how the words are put together or spaced apart reminds me at times of a river's water sliding over stones of differing sizes, over sandy bars, and bumping with varying degrees of force against those things which have fallen into it before flowing on again.
It is funny how different we read the Sil. We all love it, but it is very different things that intrique us. I for one found Ainulindalë kind of dry and dull, especially the first time I read it. Just a creation that needed to be there, where as I found the rest of the Sil thrilling almost more exiting than LotR. I am sure it is my love for history and historical works that shines through here. After reading about how pio expirience the Ainulindalë, it makes me wonder if I read through it to quickly or is just prejudice towards it. I would hate missing out at something so wonderful as pio describes it.

I guess I see the Ainulindalë as an intro that explains a few things, but realy confusses me more. Well it did the first time I read it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aiwendil
It is interesting to compare the Ainulindale with other creation myths. Perhaps the most obvious comparison one can make is with the Judeo-Christian creation story told in Genesis. We know, of course, that Tolkien was Catholic; but I think that there are as many interesting differences between the Ainulindale and Genesis as there are similarities. One thing that strikes me is the crucial role that the Ainur play in the creation, which doesn’t seem to be mirrored by anything in the Judeo-Christian story.

A survey of other creation myths – Greek, Norse, Egyptian, etc. – might also shed interesting light on the Ainulindale. From the little I know about these various stories, it seems to me that Tolkien’s creation myth is at once quite novel and firmly in the tradition of “real” origin stories.
I agree that the most obvious creation myth is the Judeo-Christian, but then again I don't know the Egyptian and it has been some time since I read the Greek and Norse.

I do see some simulareties in Norse and Greek with Ainulindale, although they are not that clear. Of course you have the "theme of Melkor" wich is some sort of rebelion, if my memorie does not fail me you also have a rebeilion in these two myths. How ever the rebellions succede in these. I am sure there are others and better simulareties, but in the end I think the Ainulindale is more like the Judeo-Christian creation myth than anyothers. With the one god who creates it all.
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Old 09-15-2006, 10:22 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by Rune Son of Bjarne
I am sure there are others and better simulareties, but in the end I think the Ainulindale is more like the Judeo-Christian creation myth than anyothers. With the one god who creates it all.
But, of course, this is, one could almost say, the very PURPOSE of the Ainulindalë: to reconcile, for Middle-Earth, a monotheistic and a polytheistic tradition. Any Tolkien scholar worth his Legolas cut-out knows that the Valar are Arda's equivalent of the Greek/Norse/Egyptian/other pagan gods, fulfilling much the same role in the story. Tolkien clearly loved the Norse and Greek mythologies, and Middle-Earth is an attempt to create legends in the same vein (well, some of it is...). But with this he had to reconcile his monotheistic belief- a belief overpowering enough that he could not bring himself to write of a world where there was NOT a one, true God. In this, of course, Tolkien isn't really helped by his assertion that Middle-Earth IS (or, rather, WAS) our world. If he believed in a one God in our world today, then if Middle-Earth is to be "genuinely feigned" it must also have one God.

But that is to recap what we all already know...

I too must join the ranks of those whose clamouring voices love the Ainulindalë. 'Tis no coincidence, methinks, that it survived from the "Music of the Ainur" not so much changed, as it was expanded. The tale has, as noted, a natural flow and rhythm to it. I note this particularly in the use of the THREE musical themes, and the repetitious use of "Ilúvatar stood and raised (a) hand(s), and his countenance was (XXX)". In this, the Ainulindalë becomes reminiscent of various fairy tales, such as "The Three Little Pigs", or "Goldilocks and the Three Bears". It gives the Ainulindalë a very clear feeling of having been composed by the Eldar in Valinor, drawing from such as the Valar were able/willing to tell them. Which, of course, is what it is feigned to be. In the unaltered texts, the Ainulindalë is ascribed to Rúmil of Tirion.
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Old 09-15-2006, 10:45 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by pio
I have to say, when I first got a copy of the Silmarillion, sometime in the late '70s, I found it rather a dry read. Histories have never captured my interest; and it was difficult to switch from reading Tolkien as an exciting novelist to Tolkien the historian. Suffice it to say, it took me a long time to read through it.
I think a lot of would-be Silmarillion readers stumble over the Ainulindalë. It's a long way from either An Un- or A Long-expected Party in tone and style. I stumbled on it in the 70's; in fact I don't think I even made it to the Quenta proper back in those days. I didn't get through the Silm until after I joined the Downs.

I won't belabor the praise already offered, except to add that I think the idea of a world conceived in song is a quite extraordinarily beautiful one. There's something so primally dramatic -- and hopeful -- in the image of order and harmony triumphantly incorporating and overcoming Melkor's attempts to ruin the Music with his discord.
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Old 09-18-2006, 12:36 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by piosenniel
The repetition of sounds in the sentences and how the words are put together or spaced apart reminds me at times of a river's water sliding over stones of differing sizes, over sandy bars, and bumping with varying degrees of force against those things which have fallen into it before flowing on again.
In many creation myths, from Judeo-Christian to Native American, the earth is created either out of of in spite of water. It strikes me that water is similar to music. Many words that describe water also can be used to describe music; for example, in the Ainulindale, the second theme began "amid the storm", and the third theme was a "mere rippling" at first, then "took to to itself power and profundity" (5). What also intrigues me is that Ulmo was "of all most deeply...instructed by Iluvatar in music" (8). I think pio's comment on how the whole piece feels like water fits in well with this theme. But why is this important? Perhaps it lends the writing some sort of authenticity, because it is similar to what we all "know", and yet it is unique...other than that, I don't know.

Furthermore, I have to follow Anguirel's fascination with Melkor. He has substance, facets that the other Ainur (save Ulmo, maybe) lack. He gives us something to think about. Melkor actually DOES something for himself, because he wants to. And there wouldn't really be a point without him, would there?

I absolutely adore this selection (see pio's comment above). It took me awhile to understand what was going on, but once I got it, and listened to it aloud, it was amazing. I still hear Martin Shaw every time I read it!
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Old 09-18-2006, 01:36 PM   #8
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I like this creation myth as its a satisfying one. I venture to say I always found Genesis unsatisfying as we don't find out much about how the world is made, that immense period when there was no sentient life but gas and rocks and lava and water and winds. Tolkien gives us it:

Quote:
Thus began the first battle of the Valar with Melkor for the dominion of Arda; and of those tumults the Elves know but little. For what has here been declared is come from the Valar themselves, with whom the Eldalie spoke in the land of Valinor, and by whom they were instructed; but little would the Valar ever tell of the wars before the coming of the Elves. Yet it is told among the Eldar that the Valar endeavoured ever, in despite of Melkor, to rule the Earth and to prepare it for the coming of the Firstborn; and they built lands and Melkor destroyed them; valleys they delved and Melkor raised them up; mountains they carved and Melkor
threw them down; seas they hollowed and Melkor spilled them; and naught might have peace or come to lasting growth, for as surely as the Valar began a labour so would Melkor undo it or corrupt it. And yet their labour was not all in vain; and though nowhere and in no work was their will and purpose wholly fulfilled, and all things were in hue and shape other than the Valar had at first intended, slowly nonetheless the Earth was fashioned and made firm. And thus was the habitation of the Children of Iluvatar established at the last in the Deeps of Time and amidst the innumerable stars
The metaphor of Gods battling one another to create and shape, and re-shape, a world is not only colourful but it works in comparison to both what we know about Geology and works in context of a secondary world which has Gods. We know our world was created over billions of years of erosion, attrition, creation of sedementary rocks, emergence of new chemical combinations etc, whole continents shifted across the globe, constantly reforming (and still are, as India continues to move North two inches per year). I find that poetic myself, but Tolkien puts it beautifully. The Ainur also embody aspects of the world that was created, and the metaphor of Air (Manwe) and Water (Ulmo) combining to create rain is beautiful:

Quote:
Then Ulmo answered: Truly, Water is become now fairer than my heart imagined, neither had my secret thought conceived the snowflake, nor in all my music was contained the falling of the rain. I will seek Manwe, that he and I may make melodies for ever to thy delight!' And Manwe and Ulmo have from the beginning been allied
The Ainur are real Gods in the most ancient sense in that they are allowed to dream up this world and the flora within it, and they create in their own image, Illuvatar giving them the power to do so. Illuvatar simply creates the Ainur, then allows them to sing - Illuvatar then makes real what they have sung about and gives the world people to populate it. The Ainur are embodied in the physical aspects of this world, the elements and the weather; they reside in Arda, and they cannot leave it until the end of time (Arda time at least).

Does Melkor come across as cool? Well, read this:

Quote:
His envy grew then the greater within him; and he also took visible form, but because of his mood and the malice that burned in him that form was dark and terrible. And he descended upon Arda in power and majesty greater than any other of the Valar, as a mountain that wades in the sea and has its head above the clouds and is clad in ice and crowned with smoke and fire; and the light of the eyes of Melkor was like a flame that withers with heat and pierces with a deadly cold
He sounds quite impressive to me.

One final thought for now. One thing really intrigues me. Illuvatar created many more Ainur than those we know about, and they stayed with him in the Void. I often get the impression that Eru was playing a little 'game' in getting his Ainur to sing and then showing them what that song would look like; some liked what they saw and wanted to go there (a little like how Tolkien fans like what they saw and some want to get a one-way ticket to Middle-earth ). Eru then just went "pfff!" and it existed, so those Ainur who liked it could go there and play with it. Oh and of course he added a few people too (as a doll's house with no dolls to sit on the chairs aint much fun).

If Eru was this tricksy (and Tricksy he was indeed, if the Ainur were "the offspring of his thought" he must have had something of the Melkor about him alongside the cuddly stuff) what was to stop him getting the rest of the Ainur to have further sing songs and creating other worlds?
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Old 09-18-2006, 01:43 PM   #9
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Some interesting thoughts from everyone. I think that both Piosenniel and Mister Underhill have annunciated what I find so appealing about this work; there's something very beautiful about the prose (even on the level of sound) as well as in the elegance of the concept. I'm a bit of a musician, and I've always found Tolkien's description of the music very evocative:

Quote:
. . . and a sound arose of endless interchanging melodies woven in harmony that passed beyond hearing into the depths and into the heights, and the places of the dwelling of Iluvatar were filled to overflowing, and the music and the echo of the music went out into the Void, and it was not void.
But perhaps my favorite passage is:
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In the midst of this strife, whereat the halls of Iluvatar shook and a tremor ran out into the silences yet unmoved, Iluvatar arose a third time, and his face was terrible to behold. Then he raised up both his hands, and in one chord, deeper than the Abyss, higher than the Firmament, piercing as the light of the eye of Iluvatar, the Music ceased.
A suggestion of the end of the world (Dagor Dagorath), perhaps?

Raynor wrote:
Quote:
Well... Eru is named the "one wholly free Will and Agent" (letter #156); ultimately, _all_ creation, from Ainu to rocks, is a manifestation of Eru
I'm not sure I agree. Certainly everything in the world was created by Iluvatar, but surely that's different from everything being a manifestation of him.

Bethberry wrote:
Quote:
Eru is identified in the second line of the story by the masculine pronoun and he alone is accorded the priviledge of supreme creation. Creation for Tolkien is thus a male perogative?
One could say the same about Judeo-Christianity, of course. Certainly there's a kind of sexism there, but I think there are two possible types to be distinguished; is it conceptual or linguistic sexism? In other words, is it true that Iluvatar is fundamentally "male", or is this a case of the masculine pronoun being used as a sort of default for a person of unspecified sex (something that happens in English all the time)? If you ask me, the former offense is significantly graver than the latter.

Quote:
when were the Ainur given the Secret Fire?
An interesting question. A related one is: if the Ainur were "kindled with the Flamer Imperishable", why did Melkor spend so much time seeking the Secret Fire in the Void? I have always understood the text to mean not that the Ainur were given the Secret Fire (as Melkor wanted) but simply that Iluvatar had created them using the Secret Fire - and that as a result, they have a kind of sub-creative ability.

What it means for the Secret Fire to be "at the heart of the World", as [i]Mark12_30[/b] inquires, is another mystery.

Quote:
And, am I correct in understanding that time exists only once Iluvatar enunciates his famous "Ea" (which word I think also belongs to Babylonian creation myth). My mind boggles at music outside of time--a music without a succession of notes?
I remember having some discussion of this point in a thread long ago, but its name escapes me. What I said there was that, in my view, stories about places "without time" invariably do seem to involve time. Without time, nothing happens. There could be no creation, no thought, etc., etc. I've therefore always understood the "Timeless Halls" of Iluvatar not to be "timeless" in that sense - perhaps, rather, timeless in that they are eternal.

Laitoste wrote:
Quote:
It strikes me that water is similar to music. Many words that describe water also can be used to describe music; for example, in the Ainulindale, the second theme began "amid the storm", and the third theme was a "mere rippling" at first, then "took to to itself power and profundity" (5). What also intrigues me is that Ulmo was "of all most deeply...instructed by Iluvatar in music" (8).
A very good point. It seems to me that Tolkien continually associates water and music. Aren't the Teleri (the Elves closest to Ulmo and most enamoured of the Sea) said to be great musicians? I also seem to recall some statement (somewhere in HoMe, perhaps) to the effect that an echo of the Music of the Ainur lives still in the seas and the rivers of the world.

Edit: cross-posted with Lalwende
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Old 09-18-2006, 02:14 PM   #10
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I remember having some discussion of this point in a thread long ago, but its name escapes me. What I said there was that, in my view, stories about places "without time" invariably [i]do seem to involve time. Without time, nothing happens. There could be no creation, no thought, etc., etc. I've therefore always understood the "Timeless Halls" of Iluvatar not to be "timeless" in that sense - perhaps, rather, timeless in that they are eternal.
I would say that Time is a construct of mortal people, a way of dviding and conquering the space that's alloted to us in existence. To someone immortal, who lived in a place that had no mortality, Time would be irrelevant; there would be no need to measure existence so Time would not need to exist.

Although current scientific thought suggests that there is no such thing as eternity as the Universe will cease to exist entirely at some point. So for us, even if we had lived since the first days of Homo Sapiens and would live to the last days, there has to be Time.

If Eru is outside even the Universe (could he be?) then he could exist outside the boundary of Time. Though there must be time for the Ainur as they were created so at least they have a beginning - Eru, it seems, does not.

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Old 09-18-2006, 04:59 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by Aiwendil
A very good point. It seems to me that Tolkien continually associates water and music. Aren't the Teleri (the Elves closest to Ulmo and most enamoured of the Sea) said to be great musicians?
Are they? If so, they would fit the image I have of music being associated with the sea...perhaps because of relaxing images and calming music?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aiwendil
I also seem to recall some statement (somewhere in HoMe, perhaps) to the effect that an echo of the Music of the Ainur lives still in the seas and the rivers of the world.
Are you talking about this passage?
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Originally Posted by Valaquenta
Ulmo speaks to those who dwell in Middle-Earth with voices that are heard only as the music of the water. For all seas, lakes, rivers, fountains, and springs are in his government, so that the Elves say that the spirit of Ulmo runs in all the veins of the world.
I've not read HoME yet...but if this is the passage, you're getting a bit ahead of yourself! But it makes sense. Ulmo is the Valar most connected to Arda, so it follows that he would continue to make music and "create" thoughts in Elves and Men...
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Old 09-20-2006, 08:34 AM   #12
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Bęthberry is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.Bęthberry is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.Bęthberry is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.Bęthberry is wading through snowdrifts on Redhorn.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aiwendil
One could say the same about Judeo-Christianity, of course. Certainly there's a kind of sexism there, but I think there are two possible types to be distinguished; is it conceptual or linguistic sexism? In other words, is it true that Iluvatar is fundamentally "male", or is this a case of the masculine pronoun being used as a sort of default for a person of unspecified sex (something that happens in English all the time)? If you ask me, the former offense is significantly graver than the latter.
There's been a fair bit of thought and discussion gone into this idea that one can distinguish a conceptual from a linguistic notion and much of it has demonstrated that this idea of a default unspecified gender reference is an erroneous concept--that always, at some place, the lack of specificity falls down, and in its place lies the defining position of one particular specified gender. Tolkien was writing before this became an issue in linguistics of course, which suggests that his use of language will demonstrate the gender traits linguist scholars have since recognised.

Given that Tolkien has--as Formendacil pointed out--begun his mythology with monotheistic creation and that creation uses the metaphor of song/music rather than the birth metaphor of many other creation myths (not all of them use such metaphors of course), I think it is difficult to argue that Iluvatar/Eru would be a gender-inclusive creator. (Although there is mention in Ainulindule that the Valar clothe themselves in male and female forms, not one female name is given here. One would think that, if the Valar or Iluvatar himself were not gender specific, at least some of the Ainur named therein would be female.) There is some research to suggest that in the Judeo-Christian tradition which you mention, there is archeological evidence to demonstrate that the ancient Israelite tribes did have a female goddess who was usurpt and occluded by the rise of monotheistic thought.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lal
If Eru was this tricksy (and Tricksy he was indeed, if the Ainur were "the offspring of his thought" he must have had something of the Melkor about him alongside the cuddly stuff)
This is the logical conundrum of monotheism, isn't it? It's possible to see Iluvatar's boast about his powers as the source of Melkor's own pride.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ainulindale
The one [music] was deep and wide and beautiful, but slow and blended with an immeasurable sorrow, from which its beauty chiefly came.
Until this point, hasn't beauty been associated with harmony? Yet now sorrow is held the prime source of beauty. Interesting.
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