Do the Ringwraiths feel pain? - The Barrow-Downs Discussion Forum

Blind Guardian · 05-13-2010, 01:05 PM

They fall off the fellbeast in the movies and Eowyn stabs the Witch-King and he doesn't seem to move. So do they feel pain? Or is it just another-annoying-thing-flying-at-me?

Inziladun · 05-13-2010, 01:17 PM

It seems that they do. At least the Witch-king, the most powerful of them does.

Quote:

[The Witch-king] bent over [Éowyn] like a cloud, and his eyes glittered; he raised his mace to kill.
But suddenly he too stumbled forward with a cry of bitter pain, and his stroke went wide, driving into the ground. Merry's sword had stabbed him from behind....

The Battle of the Pelannor Fields (emphasis added)

Presumably that idea was carried over to the movies. At least I don't recall anything which would conflict with it.

Blind Guardian · 05-13-2010, 01:32 PM

Yeah, and when Frodo stabbed him he cried to, but I don't think that was of pain, more of surprise and Elbereth name. I haven't got to that part of LotR yet!

alatar · 05-13-2010, 01:51 PM

Interesting. The Ringwraiths would have to be able to feel 'something,' as if they couldn't, they would not be able to sit on/control their horses/fell beasts, use their real world (ME) swords, or accurate swing a mace at a maiden's head.

That said, the one Aragorn sets ablaze at Weathertop seems more annoyed that he will have to sit in wardrobe for a few hours than if he really felt the fire.

mormegil · 05-13-2010, 02:02 PM

I always figured it was more of a mental pain than an actual physical pain but I haven't contemplated it much either. As Alatar points out if they have not sensory ability how could they wield weapons, ride a horse, etc...

I would think that their pain would be different from that of normal man. How though I'm not exactly sure, like I said I think it would be more of mental anguish than an actual physical pain.

Inziladun · 05-13-2010, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mormegil

I would think that their pain would be different from that of normal man. How though I'm not exactly sure, like I said I think it would be more of mental anguish than an actual physical pain.

Why not physical? Their bodies were invisible, but they still existed. If fire did not physically affect them, why would they fear it?

Puddleglum · 08-30-2010, 12:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kimsmarkin

I do not know that the Nazgul were afraid of water. Do the books say?

There is a discussion of this in "Unfinished Tales", spec in JRRT's essay "The Hunt for the Ring". Tolkien did explicitly state that ringwraiths were afraid of water and would not willingly enter it.

However, CT, in his notes on the essay observed that this left unexplained how the ringwraiths had crossed Greyflood on their journey north (where the only crossing was a dangerous ford - same place where Boromir lost his horse). CT commented that his "father did note that the idea (fear of water) was indeed difficult to sustain."

So, while Tolkien did present the idea in some of his writings, he also was uncertain whether the idea fit within the story.

Nerwen · 09-02-2010, 06:33 AM

Welcome to the Downs, Puddleglum!

I'm afraid you've just been talking to a spambot.

Inziladun · 09-02-2010, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nerwen

I'm afraid you've just been talking to a spambot.

I agree with you.

Lately, they've been getting better at looking legitimate at first glance.

05-13-2010, 01:51 PM	#4
alatar Doubting Dwimmerlaik Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Heaven's basement Posts: 2,466	Interesting. The Ringwraiths would have to be able to feel 'something,' as if they couldn't, they would not be able to sit on/control their horses/fell beasts, use their real world (ME) swords, or accurate swing a mace at a maiden's head. That said, the one Aragorn sets ablaze at Weathertop seems more annoyed that he will have to sit in wardrobe for a few hours than if he really felt the fire. __________________ There is naught that you can do, other than to resist, with hope or without it.

05-13-2010, 02:02 PM	#5
mormegil Maundering Mage Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Texas Posts: 4,651	I always figured it was more of a mental pain than an actual physical pain but I haven't contemplated it much either. As Alatar points out if they have not sensory ability how could they wield weapons, ride a horse, etc... I would think that their pain would be different from that of normal man. How though I'm not exactly sure, like I said I think it would be more of mental anguish than an actual physical pain. __________________ “I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo. "So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us.”

09-02-2010, 06:33 AM	#8
Nerwen Wisest of the Noldor Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: ˙˙˙ssɐןƃ ƃuıʞooן ǝɥʇ ɥƃnoɹɥʇ Posts: 6,694	Welcome to the Downs, Puddleglum! I'm afraid you've just been talking to a spambot. __________________ "Even Nerwen wasn't evil in the beginning." –Elmo.